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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8896209
08/06/23 11:55 AM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 752
M16
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I have a good supply of Reloader 26. This is my highest powder charge load I tried. Peterson SRP brass CCI 450 Primer 43.0 grains Reloader 26 Hornady 75 grain Amax 2851 FPS ES 3 SD 2.4 Group size .405
Load data I have is maximum charge weight at 43.2. So still a little below maximum. But that extra .2 grains won't get me another 250 fps. One thing I noticed was the large amount of carbon fouling with this load. I've been breaking in the barrel and the carbon fouling was off the charts. I just got in 500 Peterson LRP brass so will try again and see if the large rifle primers make a difference.
I'm loving the fit and finish and accuracy with the Vandal. What an unbelievable price for such a quality rifle. Balance with or without a suppressor is just perfect for taking anything in Texas.
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8896246
08/06/23 01:20 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,644
DStroud
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Hard to argue with that accuracy and the consistency and coyotes don’t know how fast a bullets going when it hits them. I am assuming you are getting data from Peterson website as I think they are the only ones I am aware of that checked pressures. Also not sure what seating depth they were using.
The powder that Hornady is using is not available to us but I have had no problem matching it with R26. Also you said you were breaking in the barrel. How many rounds at this point? I have reloaded 75gr much higher than that but my load that I have found in three barrels that “seems” (but not pressure tested) fine for good brass life is 44.0gr with OAL 2.640 That’s also with Peterson brass.
Every barrel is different …some are slower some are faster than norm. My Bergara and Tikka 6.5 factory barrels were same length and there was 75 fps difference in them with same load. Tikka hammer forged barrels seem to have a reputation of being slow from reading the internet but not sure if it’s anecdotal or it’s proven.
I think the heavy carbon may be from the copper remover that’s in the Alliant powders but it cleans out pretty easy if you stay ahead of it.
You are on the right track for sure and glad the rifle is shooting well!
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."
Jack O'Connor 1963
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: DStroud]
#8896262
08/06/23 01:43 PM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 752
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Thanks for that info. I got that load info from Peterson. I don't believe they tested that load for pressure. It was just an estimate. So it my be a little on the low side. I guess it's a sign of old age when you don't feel the need to push everything to the maximum. I'll play with it a little more and move a little higher with the powder charge. I do have a keg of Staball and will try some of that as well. H4831 and H4350 gave similar results. But an extra 200 or so fps won't kill anything any deader if you put the bullet in the right place.
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8896298
08/06/23 02:33 PM
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Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 197
Hunter307
Woodsman
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Woodsman
Joined: Dec 2016
Posts: 197 |
22 creed with the 88gr eldm would be a fantastic deer combo.
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8896465
08/06/23 07:22 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,551
kmon11
junior
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junior
Joined: Sep 2006
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22-243 here but similar velocities I really like the 75gr Swift Sirocco for deer at about 3400fps it ha dome very well. For deer and hogs it has done well from 10 yards to over 400 yards. It does copper foul faster than the others though but shoots well in my rifle.
When I was shooting it the most I had never heard of a Creedmoor round
lf the saying "Liar, Liar your pants on fire" were true Mainstream news might be fun to watch
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: DStroud]
#8896474
08/06/23 07:34 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 22,750
BigPig
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Hard to argue with that accuracy and the consistency and coyotes don’t know how fast a bullets going when it hits them.
I beg to differ. There’s a reason I shoot 243 over everything else for coyotes and that’s the speed upon impact and how hard it locks them up. It’s way more impressive than any slower cartridge.
Wade Dews, REALTOR ® Rendon Realty, LLC Frontline Real Estate Team www.RendonRealty.comWadeDews@gmail.com 214-356-2410 Up to 1% for closing costs for First Responders & Veterans Proudly partnered with Assist The Officer Foundation https://atodallas.org/
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: BigPig]
#8896483
08/06/23 07:45 PM
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,551
kmon11
junior
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junior
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 32,551 |
Hard to argue with that accuracy and the consistency and coyotes don’t know how fast a bullets going when it hits them.
I beg to differ. There’s a reason I shoot 243 over everything else for coyotes and that’s the speed upon impact and how hard it locks them up. It’s way more impressive than any slower cartridge. Speed kills but you are getting that with what a 243 and a 55 or 58gr bullet. Load that bullet weight in a 22 Creedmoor and watch the same results. One of my favorite coyote rounds is the 17 Remington, mine runs 4250 with a 25gr pill every Coyote I have shot with it has locked up and died right there with no flopping about including gut shots and no pelt damage. Keep it inside 200 yards though. You are correct in agreeing with Roy Weatherby though "Speed Kills"
lf the saying "Liar, Liar your pants on fire" were true Mainstream news might be fun to watch
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: kmon11]
#8897183
08/07/23 10:33 PM
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Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 22,750
BigPig
THF Celebrity
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Hard to argue with that accuracy and the consistency and coyotes don’t know how fast a bullets going when it hits them.
I beg to differ. There’s a reason I shoot 243 over everything else for coyotes and that’s the speed upon impact and how hard it locks them up. It’s way more impressive than any slower cartridge. Speed kills but you are getting that with what a 243 and a 55 or 58gr bullet. Load that bullet weight in a 22 Creedmoor and watch the same results. One of my favorite coyote rounds is the 17 Remington, mine runs 4250 with a 25gr pill every Coyote I have shot with it has locked up and died right there with no flopping about including gut shots and no pelt damage. Keep it inside 200 yards though. You are correct in agreeing with Roy Weatherby though "Speed Kills" True, but I’ve always shot the 75 or 78 grain Vmax for coyotes. Best of both worlds, fast and heavy(ish). I’m curious to see how the muzzle flash and blast is compared to a 18 inch 243.
Wade Dews, REALTOR ® Rendon Realty, LLC Frontline Real Estate Team www.RendonRealty.comWadeDews@gmail.com 214-356-2410 Up to 1% for closing costs for First Responders & Veterans Proudly partnered with Assist The Officer Foundation https://atodallas.org/
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8897509
08/08/23 01:55 PM
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,320
Crews
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I'm sure this has been addressed elsewhere, but if you were to shoot 22 Creed and 6 Creed in the same weight rifle, is the 22 Creed perceived recoil significantly less? Or pretty close to the same?
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: Crews]
#8897526
08/08/23 02:14 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 19,361
Judd
#1 Creedmoor Fan
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#1 Creedmoor Fan
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 19,361 |
I'm sure this has been addressed elsewhere, but if you were to shoot 22 Creed and 6 Creed in the same weight rifle, is the 22 Creed perceived recoil significantly less? Or pretty close to the same? You can tell a difference but it's not a massive difference.
Don't let your ears hear what your eyes didn't see, and don't let your mouth say what your heart doesn't feel
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: Crews]
#8897751
08/08/23 08:08 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,644
DStroud
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I'm sure this has been addressed elsewhere, but if you were to shoot 22 Creed and 6 Creed in the same weight rifle, is the 22 Creed perceived recoil significantly less? Or pretty close to the same? Two points here. Yes you will have less felt recoil and muzzle blast from the 22 Creedmoor but as you shorten the barrels on both they get worse obviously. I would say since the 6mm CM and 243 Win are burning 5-10gr more powder the shorter you go the bigger the felt difference.
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."
Jack O'Connor 1963
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8897765
08/08/23 08:28 PM
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 1,320
Crews
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An excellent point, because I always choose shorties. So you’re saying 22 Creed is (probably) noticeably less recoil than the 6 in something like an 18” barrel?
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8897792
08/08/23 09:20 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,644
DStroud
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I would say yes.. example load in 22 Creedmoor with 75 gr is 41.0 gr H4350 and in the 6mm Creedmoor that same weight bullet uses 48.0gr so muzzle blast will be worse no doubt.
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."
Jack O'Connor 1963
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8898629
08/10/23 03:25 AM
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,732
HorizonFirearms
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Thanks Dstroud! got a little behind but you got the data out. As far as the recoil question about the 6mm vs 22 Backfire does a really good comparison as well that includes the recoil differences. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kOHJQ_bpSwg
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8898873
08/10/23 04:36 PM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 752
M16
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I remembered having a couple of boxes of Copper Creek 22 Creedmoor 70 grain ammo. I ran three rounds through my Vandal to see how velocities compared to my handloads. Average velocity was 2926fps for a three shot group. Which falls right in line with published load data. So maybe I have a slow barrel that will speed up with more use. Or it seems lots of people are running over pressure loads. I think I'll just run at the lower published velocities and be happy with a well balanced rifle that shoots extremely well. It will be interesting to see what velocity the Hornady factory ammo will deliver.
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8898874
08/10/23 04:39 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,983
ChadTRG42
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That's slow! I'm running 75 grain bullets at 3300-3500 fps, depending on barrel lengths. Some shooters are running short barrels suppressed and getting 3300+ fps with 75 grain ELD-M bullets.
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#8898886
08/10/23 05:02 PM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 752
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That's slow! I'm running 75 grain bullets at 3300-3500 fps, depending on barrel lengths. Some shooters are running short barrels suppressed and getting 3300+ fps with 75 grain ELD-M bullets. I’m assuming your loads are pressure tested? What pressures are you running?
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: M16]
#8898893
08/10/23 05:07 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,983
ChadTRG42
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That's slow! I'm running 75 grain bullets at 3300-3500 fps, depending on barrel lengths. Some shooters are running short barrels suppressed and getting 3300+ fps with 75 grain ELD-M bullets. I’m assuming your loads are pressure tested? What pressures are you running? Yes, when you get sticky bolt lift, you back off the powder charge!! True pressure testing costs 10's of thousands of dollars for ONE load. It's not rocket science (but it kind of is) on where you need to be at to run safe ammo.
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: ChadTRG42]
#8898900
08/10/23 05:31 PM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 752
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That's slow! I'm running 75 grain bullets at 3300-3500 fps, depending on barrel lengths. Some shooters are running short barrels suppressed and getting 3300+ fps with 75 grain ELD-M bullets. I’m assuming your loads are pressure tested? What pressures are you running? Yes, when you get sticky bolt lift, you back off the powder charge!! True pressure testing costs 10's of thousands of dollars for ONE load. It's not rocket science (but it kind of is) on where you need to be at to run safe ammo. “Yea sticky bolts happen when you get 10,000 psi plus over SAMMI.
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8898908
08/10/23 05:46 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 18,983
ChadTRG42
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For the 22 Creedmoor, if you look at multiple published reloading data, you can easily achieve 3400+ fps with a 75 grain bullet with multiple powders. And I think some of that published reloading data is conservative.
I'm doing a load work up right now in a 223 Rem Tikka Varmint with a 24" barrel now. One of the loads I tested is running a 68 grain Hornady BTHP at 2993 fps. Why would you want to run a 70 grain in a 22 Creedmoor at 2926 fps? All I'm saying is that is VERY slow for a 22 CM. You're giving up 400 fps. That's a lot.
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8899042
08/10/23 10:09 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,644
DStroud
Extreme Tracker
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I haven’t seen pressure tested published data that shows 3400fps with a 75gr bullet although I would think it’s very possible with 26 inch barrel and be under SAAMI max
The Hornady load I showed on page one was pressure tested and it has the 80 gr going 3400 so it’s doable but short barrels with small holes in them lose velocity fast when chopped off
Last edited by DStroud; 08/10/23 10:17 PM.
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."
Jack O'Connor 1963
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8899320
08/11/23 03:01 PM
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Joined: Jul 2013
Posts: 2,784
Gone to Texas
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That's big news! Congrats!
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8904751
08/20/23 04:05 PM
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 752
M16
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Just an update. I got in some Alpha large rifle primer brass. What a difference in velocity. Using Reloader 26 I've settled on a load that is running right around 3100 fps. Last group I shot measured .270. Coyotes and other critter beware.
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: M16]
#8905623
08/21/23 10:00 PM
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Joined: Nov 2011
Posts: 3,644
DStroud
Extreme Tracker
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Extreme Tracker
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Just an update. I got in some Alpha large rifle primer brass. What a difference in velocity. Using Reloader 26 I've settled on a load that is running right around 3100 fps. Last group I shot measured .270. Coyotes and other critter beware. Good to hear!
"Anyone taking up handloading necessarily plays with unknown factors and takes chances. But so does anyone who drives a car,goes to a cocktail party,eats in a restaurant,or gets married."
Jack O'Connor 1963
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Re: 22 Creed officially on its way to be Saami Approved
[Re: HorizonFirearms]
#8911864
09/04/23 05:14 PM
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Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 317
Bradgrace
Bird Dog
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Bird Dog
Joined: Jun 2011
Posts: 317 |
Just got my action and barrel ordered. Excited to give this caliber a try.
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