Well i do not condone neck shots with small calibers either, I said, if you would read back a little, nothing less than a .270 will break neck and sever spine killing the deer with a shot placed anywhere on the neck. I know hunting writer's and journalist wouldn't support it, but i really didn't ask them either, the OP was which is more humane, i say a neck shot dispatches the animal ten times as fast....that is from my experience and I've killed a lot of deer....I am not exclusive to the neck shot, I killed 4 deer with vital shots last year, i jut prefer to see the deer drop right there and a neck shot with the gun(s) i shoot does that well......wand anagous....how about those convinced against their will are of the same opinion still

Two of the deer I almost lost to neck shots were with a 270 and a 300 Win Mag. Both deer had fist sized holes on the off side (exit) of the neck just above the spine and less than 1.5" from the spine.

So I don't buy the "it takes a .270 to break the neck even if spine is missed". Who came up with the scientific formula do determine this??

Of the well over 100 whitetail and mule deer I have shot in my life and propably twice that many more I've been witness too, I've never seen this formula.

I don't think the caliber matters as much as the fact there is just not alot of room for error on neck shots.

Yes a gut shot deer from a botched vital shot can and often is lost, but at least it will die within a few hours, not after few days of starvation/dehydration/infection from a botched head or neck shot.

Of course deer hit just ABOVE the spine in the neck often fully recover.

Bill

WOW thats a strong statement, from a guy that probley shots 1-3 deer a year, if that. Thats assuming you have found a land owner thats willing to lease to you.

i agree about neck shooting with solids not being as effectetive. everybody thinks bigger is always better. but, shooting fast rifles like 7 mags, 300wsm, and other solid fast casing may sometimes work in reverse. they go through the meat too fast, and if you make a good shot but miss bone can result in no knockdown. a perfect bullet is on that makes full pass through, but comes out the other side barely leaving all the kenentic energy in the animals body, not wasting abunch flying out the other side

smaller calibers(222, 22-250, 223, even 243) with a hollow point is the best neck shot guns there are. i gurentee if you hit square in the neck anywhere they are done. i've seen and shot hundreds of deer with these and i can't think of one that got away if it close to point of aim. on the otherhand, i once tracked a black buck shot squarely in the neck with a 30 caliber solid for two miles. complete pass through!!! i actually walked up to it thinking it was dead and it got up ran away and was never found. lesson learned for me

its no scientific formula, hell, i made it up....but if you look at the energy from a .270 or better at time of impact, and really a .243 for that matter, it does allow for some error on a neck shot, the punch alone will break neck and spine, I would have like to seen the deer running with a fist sized hole in its neck, one thing about it they are amazing sometimes and I woul'nt say that its 100% nothing in Deer hunting is.

tx270i re read one of my old posts and it it said ...nothing less than a .270....that statement did not come out clear...what i mean is I wouldn't use anything less...

deershepard i do not like the use of small calibers for a neck shot, reason being they do not have the energy needed to allow for the margin of error you need to kill, meaning you need a direct or close direct to the spine with a small cal and with a larger caliber the energy will snap it nearly everytime...I have skilled quite a few deer with neck shots from a .223 but i had one run with a hole in its neck and chose not to hunt deer with a .223, that is a different topic all together and has been brought up many times here. the .223 is fast and will exit as will the .270 7 mag ect....with soft points, which i assume all deer rounds are, you shouldn't have to worry about passing through and not delivering the needed punch....270 and greater will give it the punch almost every single time

If you mean by 'solid', a non expanding full metal jacket bullet, then no one should be hunting deer with those anyway.

As to the bullet going "too fast to expand" that is absolutely false. The faster a bullet is traveling the MORE it will expand. That is not my opinion, it's fact.

Bill

EXACTLY tx270

Okay, I'm not convinced what HwyMan said is true. I'd need a medical doctor to confirm that if the spinal column is severed in the neck that this kills the deer immediately. *I* think that a deer's lungs and heart keep going even with a severed spine.

Yes, I think a neck shot will usually drop a deer, but will it KILL it, immediately, if the jugular isn't hit?

If someone wants to take neck shots, that's fine with me, but I'm not taking anymore unless absolutely necessary to avoid the loss of a deer. (I.E., only shot available.)

i dropped a deer in vitals but might think about going for the neck next time

Where can I get this guarantee?

they need an icon with two smileys pissin and seeing who can piss the furtheset....

Whether a particular bullet has a soft nose or a hollow point tells you nothing about the design and construction of the bullet. There are soft points designed for rapid expansion and there are hollow points designed for rapid expansion. There are soft points designed for deep penetration and there are hollow points designed for deep penetration.

Also, could you define "square in the neck"?

What size deer were you taking?

i define square in the neckas being three inches from the center either way on a buck and prolly 2inches on a doe, really the only screw up on a neck shot is where one sould hit within an inch or so fo missing to low...AKA the wind pipe, otherthan that it should more often than not break neck

Do you think they operate on they're own? You are aware that it's the brain that control’s these functions, severe that connection and they cease to function.

On one elk i shot i aimed at the vitals and the elk took one step and fell over backwards.When it was field dressed the heart was split wide open.I'm more of a vitals shooter but if the neck is the only shot available then i wouldn't be afraid to take it. I must say i use 180g 30-06 .

So less than a minute of angle at any range. Neck shooting is a stunt.

well campers, it seems that we've reached the end of the "useful information" section of this thread. I have no doubt that the "bickering and criticizing" section will continue indefinitely, but if you are reading this thread for the first time, this is probably as good a time as any to stop reading, and move on to another topic.

A little more.

Hwy_Man -- you may be correct, but haven't you heard of the expression "paralyzed from the neck down"? This is due to a spinal cord injury in the neck, and to me, implies that yes, the heart and lungs can go on working without imput from the brain. I don't know that, which is why I was looking for some input from an M.D.

That's it. God put their eyeballs high and in front for a reason. TARGETS!

Let me clear this up for you... paralysis is caused by DAMAGE to the spinal cord. If the damage is significant, motor signals from the brain do not reach the limbs, and you have a paralyzed individual. This is VERY different from having the spinal cord severed. If this occurs, no neural impulses can travel to the heart telling it to beat, or the diaphragm telling it to contract (inflating the lungs).

This is NOT instantly fatal. It takes about 10 seconds for the oxygen currently in the brain to be depleted (resulting in unconsciousness). At this point, the animal will be essentially indistinguishable from dead, but true brain death occurs between 60 seconds, and 2 minutes later depending on which definition of brain death you subscribe to.

that being said, a DIRECT impact to the heart will take about 15 to 45 seconds longer to cause unconsciousness, as blood will no longer be circulated but the oxygen currently in the blood will sustain the animal for a longer time. Unconsciousness in this case is NOT caused by the brain losing oxygen, it is caused by an extreme drop in blood pressure as blood is lost.

there's my anatomy lesson for the day. By the way, i'm not an M.D. but i have extensive anatomy training, and years of biology and physics under my belt

I go for the lung/heart shot. I've hit them in the neck and they will die. But from my experience, if the neck shot does not break the main artery and allow the deer to bleed and loose blood pressure, then when you go to quarter it up and cut it up, the meat is very bloody because it didn't bleed out while dying. To me it effects the taste of the meat when they don't bleed out during the dying process. So now I only go for a lung/heart shot. Sometimes they will run off 50 yards or so, sometimes they fall in their tracks, but they almost always leave a good blood trail. Over the last 35 years of hunting and 150 plus deer I have found this to be a fact based on my experience. JMHO

well said deershepard. the only deer that i have been neck shot and recovered were shot with a 7 mag barely left any blood and were never found. the speed will matter on the faster guns as in the magnum calibers as will bullets. if your bullet is for deep penatration and you dont hit the bone with a super fast long range rifle as the 7mag your gonna punch right through a lot of times not everytime though. now 20 years ago when i was younger we were dirt poor and lived of of deer year round and i will guarantee you do not have to have a 270 to break a deers neck a 50gr hollow point out of a 22 mag will do it every time

Thanks BePrepared.