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Barn water freeze ??? #8989717 01/17/24 10:56 PM
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So when we built our barn we ran the water lines inside of the walls. Well rats got in there and chewed holes in the line.

So I have a plumber come out and run the water lines on the outside of the barn to several faucets. They put the foam insulation around the copper line.

Before this freeze I turned off the water that fed these lines and drained them. Go out today after it got above freezing and turned the water back on. Two major leaks spraying water everywhere. Obviously several places in the line froze and cracked.

Suggestions on how to fix this issue long term.


You can't fix stupid
Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989718 01/17/24 11:03 PM
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How many linear feet of line are we talking about?

Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989720 01/17/24 11:09 PM
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It will be low places that did not drain.
Short of redoing it with sloping lines and PEX, set up for a proper draining. Add a valve or a capped nipple at the lowest point. Get an adapter to go from email water hose to an air chuck and blow the lines out with an air compressor after you open the drain point. Start at the most distant faucets to your drain point and just blow the snot out of it.

Alternatively, if your are not worried about this often, fill the lines with RV antifreeze. I did this on the cabin for 10 years had never busted a pipe or a p-trap


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Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989722 01/17/24 11:12 PM
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every water line I fixed after the big freeze few years ago was copper, no plex or PVC

only way to protect them is run them inside or put a electric heat wrap/wire on them or run them in a way you get 100% drain


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Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989744 01/18/24 12:09 AM
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Agree with Nak.

I keep up with weather forecasts and if we are in for a hard freeze:

When I leave my mobile home in the winter, I close the water valve coming from the well under the trailer. I flush the toilet and dip most of the water left over in the bowl. Then use an air compressor at the kitchen sink to blow the water lines. Also in the bathroom sink. Then pour windshield washer anti freeze into the traps in kitchen and bathroom sinks plus the tub trap. Also a little in toilet bowl and tank.

Next to the well house. I turn off the power switch to the pump motor. Then close the valve from the tank to the well motor. Then hook a hose to the well house faucet and empty the pressure tank. Then remove the drain plug on the pump motor.

Actually, I generally do the well house first.

I’ve learned this stuff the hard/expensive way.


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Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989754 01/18/24 12:41 AM
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Been where you are. My solution was installing boiler drain valves in lowest areas with a valve in a location to provide vacuum break to allow air into high part of system.

Your case may need one or may need more drains.


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Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: nak] #8989757 01/18/24 12:50 AM
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Originally Posted by nak
It will be low places that did not drain.
Short of redoing it with sloping lines and PEX, set up for a proper draining. Add a valve or a capped nipple at the lowest point. Get an adapter to go from email water hose to an air chuck and blow the lines out with an air compressor after you open the drain point. Start at the most distant faucets to your drain point and just blow the snot out of it.

Alternatively, if your are not worried about this often, fill the lines with RV antifreeze. I did this on the cabin for 10 years had never busted a pipe or a p-trap


This is what I do.

Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989769 01/18/24 01:31 AM
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thanks guys! Good info


You can't fix stupid
Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989793 01/18/24 02:07 AM
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Nothing will withstand hard freeze like Banjo brand American made valves and fittings. Black poly construction.

The bad three freezes we've had since Feb 2020, my Banjo fittings took it in stride. They are on the north side if my cisterns and not covered. No worse for the ware.


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Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989822 01/18/24 02:47 AM
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Originally Posted by tlk
thanks guys! Good info


up

Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989829 01/18/24 02:56 AM
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You got to be able to drain them. These frost-proof yard hydrants work well. The water drains out of the vertical pipe every time you shut it off. Gravel at the bottom lets it drain.

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Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989861 01/18/24 09:10 AM
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Originally Posted by tlk
So when we built our barn we ran the water lines inside of the walls. Well rats got in there and chewed holes in the line.

So I have a plumber come out and run the water lines on the outside of the barn to several faucets. They put the foam insulation around the copper line.

Before this freeze I turned off the water that fed these lines and drained them. Go out today after it got above freezing and turned the water back on. Two major leaks spraying water everywhere. Obviously several places in the line froze and cracked.

Suggestions on how to fix this issue long term.


Run PEX and sleeve it was 2" PVC with foam insulation, or 1.5" PVC Sleeve with insulation depending on whehter you run 3/4" or 1/2" PEX.

Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8989991 01/18/24 04:18 PM
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TLK please don't put anit-freeze into barn water pipes. Someone might not know it's there and fill a water bucket or tank, then you'll have sick animals.

The solution is putting in more drains at the low points. I have 6 drains on my external water system that ensures the pipes are empty. You can also do like NAK suggests and blow the lines out if you want a belt and suspenders solution.


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Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8990620 01/19/24 10:30 PM
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Low point drains

Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: dkershen] #8990624 01/19/24 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by dkershen
TLK please don't put anit-freeze into barn water pipes. Someone might not know it's there and fill a water bucket or tank, then you'll have sick animals.

The solution is putting in more drains at the low points. I have 6 drains on my external water system that ensures the pipes are empty. You can also do like NAK suggests and blow the lines out if you want a belt and suspenders solution.


Thanks but I have no plans to put anit-freeze in my pipes


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Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8990662 01/19/24 11:48 PM
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isnt RV antifreeze different ? Its made for RV Water and wastewater systems and is a glycerin-free formula

Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: jimbob] #8990704 01/20/24 01:30 AM
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Originally Posted by jimbob
isnt RV antifreeze different ? Its made for RV Water and wastewater systems and is a glycerin-free formula


Yes and it would be a very notable color.


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Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: TurkeyHunter] #8990721 01/20/24 02:21 AM
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Originally Posted by TurkeyHunter
Originally Posted by jimbob
isnt RV antifreeze different ? Its made for RV Water and wastewater systems and is a glycerin-free formula


Yes and it would be a very notable color.

And non-toxic.


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Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8990801 01/20/24 01:34 PM
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Adding. I also have a small, temp controlled, electric heater in the well house. Cast iron pumps and copper lines can get expensive and they don’t expand worth a damn.


Without a sense of urgency, nothing ever happens.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley, Rancher Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: Dave Davidson] #8990817 01/20/24 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Davidson
Adding. I also have a small, temp controlled, electric heater in the well house. Cast iron pumps and copper lines can get expensive and they don’t expand worth a damn.



You should of gotten the expandable copper lines they sell

Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: RedRanger] #8990854 01/20/24 03:10 PM
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Ranger, the well and house is about 40 years old. How long have they sold the expandable copper? My biggest concern is the electric motor in the well house.

Last edited by Dave Davidson; 01/20/24 03:11 PM.

Without a sense of urgency, nothing ever happens.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley, Rancher Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: Dave Davidson] #8990871 01/20/24 03:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Davidson
Ranger, the well and house is about 40 years old. How long have they sold the expandable copper? My biggest concern is the electric motor in the well house.


They don't have expandable copper, I was messing with you.

Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8991338 01/21/24 01:18 PM
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I’m naive


Without a sense of urgency, nothing ever happens.

Boy, if I say "sic em", you'd better look for something to bite. Sam Shelley, Rancher Muleshoe Texas 1892-1985 RIP
Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: Dave Davidson] #8991340 01/21/24 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave Davidson
I’m naive


Actually PEX is about as close as it comes.

Re: Barn water freeze ??? [Re: tlk] #8991700 01/22/24 01:10 AM
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