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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: therancher]
#6008248
11/03/15 03:17 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,757
Rob Lay
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Then by all means beat a hasty path to those other states. And hunt those public lands. I think it's a travesty that those states are mostly govt owned. you don't have to jump so quick on the ahole bandwagon like a few here. I wouldn't be surprised if the state and federally owned land in Texas is similar % to the other states, yet why does Texas provide less access? In Kansas for example I don't think there is a huge % of public hunting land, but it seems like a bunch because they turn all the land around lakes and even roads/railroads into public access hunting. They also came up with a great program about 20 years ago where private land owners could get tax and other benefits by allowing public hunting access. I'm a land owner plus willing to pay big money for other leases and outfitters, I'm honestly part of the problem there is less hunting opportunities for the working class. I see a solution if Texas would follow the lead of states like Kansas to make more existing government land accessible and then create a program for private land owners to offer public hunting.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: fishdog]
#6008250
11/03/15 03:19 PM
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 25,421
Creekrunner
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 25,421 |
Ahh, hell.
How 'bout them Spurs!
Y'all go fix a Bloody Mary. I'm beggin' ya.
...and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth. Gen. 1:28
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: fishdog]
#6008263
11/03/15 03:28 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
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Posts: 27,091 |
TX has taken the private property model to the extreme. That's why we are "go to" state for exotics and artificial WTs.
I'm really not trying to make a policy statement with that, other than to point out that different models produce different results. Apparently the people of TX are OK with our model. IMO we have come too far for any sea change from a policy standpoint. The only agent for change will be if different attitudes result in a "bottom up" change reflected in the market. IMO the winds are beginning to blow in that direction.
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Creekrunner]
#6008265
11/03/15 03:30 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091 |
Ahh, hell.
How 'bout them Spurs!
Y'all go fix a Bloody Mary. I'm beggin' ya. A little debate will wake you up too.
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: fishdog]
#6008292
11/03/15 03:42 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,757
Rob Lay
Pro Tracker
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private > state > government
i agree with this 100% and I think most Texans do too, but I think Texas can do a better job providing public access to public lands.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Rob Lay]
#6008307
11/03/15 03:49 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637 |
Then by all means beat a hasty path to those other states. And hunt those public lands. I think it's a travesty that those states are mostly govt owned. you don't have to jump so quick on the ahole bandwagon like a few here. I wouldn't be surprised if the state and federally owned land in Texas is similar % to the other states, yet why does Texas provide less access? In Kansas for example I don't think there is a huge % of public hunting land, but it seems like a bunch because they turn all the land around lakes and even roads/railroads into public access hunting. They also came up with a great program about 20 years ago where private land owners could get tax and other benefits by allowing public hunting access. I'm a land owner plus willing to pay big money for other leases and outfitters, I'm honestly part of the problem there is less hunting opportunities for the working class. I see a solution if Texas would follow the lead of states like Kansas to make more existing government land accessible and then create a program for private land owners to offer public hunting. We have the same public lease program in Texas as KS. The difference is we price out the state. If that makes sense.. When you get to western KS and the CRP walkin areas it's a whole different land valuation, segmentation and game densities.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Rob Lay]
#6008308
11/03/15 03:50 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637 |
private > state > government
i agree with this 100% and I think most Texans do too, but I think Texas can do a better job providing public access to public lands. That I concur with. Especially the federal land!!!!!
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: fishdog]
#6008346
11/03/15 04:18 PM
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Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 241
Whiptail
Woodsman
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Woodsman
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 241 |
This is a excellent but contentious topic! How many private land permits should be issued to the LO and to the public? In Texas the current answer is 100% and 0% but I understand the complaint that wildlife, like Bighorns, are basically state property and were reintroduced with both state and private resources. I think in Colorado the LO/public split for private land bighorn permits is 50/50 but there are new bills to move to 75/25. Here's a link: http://onyourownadventures.com/hunttalk/showthread.php?p=2432930#post2432930
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Whiptail]
#6008365
11/03/15 04:30 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,757
Rob Lay
Pro Tracker
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Posts: 1,757 |
This is a excellent but contentious topic! How many private land permits should be issued to the LO and to the public? In Texas the current answer is 100% and 0% but I understand the complaint that wildlife, like Bighorns, are basically state property and were reintroduced with both state and private resources. I think in Colorado the LO/public split for private land bighorn permits is 50/50 but there are new bills to move to 75/25. Here's a link: http://onyourownadventures.com/hunttalk/showthread.php?p=2432930#post2432930 I don't think a private land owner should be forced to allow public hunts at all! I couldn't believe when I hunted Pronghorn in New Mexico that the ranch owners are forced to allow public hunting on their land.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Whiptail]
#6008378
11/03/15 04:36 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637 |
This is a excellent but contentious topic! How many private land permits should be issued to the LO and to the public? In Texas the current answer is 100% and 0% but I understand the complaint that wildlife, like Bighorns, are basically state property and were reintroduced with both state and private resources. I think in Colorado the LO/public split for private land bighorn permits is 50/50 but there are new bills to move to 75/25. Here's a link: http://onyourownadventures.com/hunttalk/showthread.php?p=2432930#post2432930 Texas is actually 70/30- 80/20% depending on the year. A tag is a tag. It's a mute topic because it doesn't grant access to private. Nor does it anywhere in the US with the exception of NM. But that's a small ranch program vs large ranch program. Large ranch get Ranch specific LO tags and Small Ranches enter drawing for a Unit wide tag, but doing so opens up your land to public hunting/access
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Whiptail]
#6008379
11/03/15 04:37 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 912
fishdog
OP
Tracker
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OP
Tracker
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 912 |
This is a excellent but contentious topic! How many private land permits should be issued to the LO and to the public? In Texas the current answer is 100% and 0% but I understand the complaint that wildlife, like Bighorns, are basically state property and were reintroduced with both state and private resources. I think in Colorado the LO/public split for private land bighorn permits is 50/50 but there are new bills to move to 75/25. Here's a link: http://onyourownadventures.com/hunttalk/showthread.php?p=2432930#post2432930 50/50,or 60/40 would both be a good plan. I dont want to take the LO tags or the finacial incentive provided to land owners away completely, just make the system a little more fair
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Rob Lay]
#6008382
11/03/15 04:38 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
|
kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637 |
This is a excellent but contentious topic! How many private land permits should be issued to the LO and to the public? In Texas the current answer is 100% and 0% but I understand the complaint that wildlife, like Bighorns, are basically state property and were reintroduced with both state and private resources. I think in Colorado the LO/public split for private land bighorn permits is 50/50 but there are new bills to move to 75/25. Here's a link: http://onyourownadventures.com/hunttalk/showthread.php?p=2432930#post2432930 I don't think a private land owner should be forced to allow public hunts at all! I couldn't believe when I hunted Pronghorn in New Mexico that the ranch owners are forced to allow public hunting on their land. They aren't forced they opted for that via entering unit wide tag drawning.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Rob Lay]
#6008387
11/03/15 04:40 PM
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Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 912
fishdog
OP
Tracker
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OP
Tracker
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 912 |
This is a excellent but contentious topic! How many private land permits should be issued to the LO and to the public? In Texas the current answer is 100% and 0% but I understand the complaint that wildlife, like Bighorns, are basically state property and were reintroduced with both state and private resources. I think in Colorado the LO/public split for private land bighorn permits is 50/50 but there are new bills to move to 75/25. Here's a link: http://onyourownadventures.com/hunttalk/showthread.php?p=2432930#post2432930 I don't think a private land owner should be forced to allow public hunts at all! I couldn't believe when I hunted Pronghorn in New Mexico that the ranch owners are forced to allow public hunting on their land. No not forced. If they want to participate in the landowner tag program and reap the finacial rewards they have to allow access for a certian number of draw tag holders. Sounds pretty fair to me. No one is making them, theres just a a big incintive if they allow access
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: fishdog]
#6008406
11/03/15 04:47 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637 |
This is a excellent but contentious topic! How many private land permits should be issued to the LO and to the public? In Texas the current answer is 100% and 0% but I understand the complaint that wildlife, like Bighorns, are basically state property and were reintroduced with both state and private resources. I think in Colorado the LO/public split for private land bighorn permits is 50/50 but there are new bills to move to 75/25. Here's a link: http://onyourownadventures.com/hunttalk/showthread.php?p=2432930#post2432930 I don't think a private land owner should be forced to allow public hunts at all! I couldn't believe when I hunted Pronghorn in New Mexico that the ranch owners are forced to allow public hunting on their land. No not forced. If they want to participate in the landowner tag program and reap the finacial rewards they have to allow access for a certian number of draw tag holders. Sounds pretty fair to me. No one is making them, theres just a a big incintive if they allow access Unit tag not ranch specific. Big difference
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: fishdog]
#6008415
11/03/15 04:49 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
|
kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637 |
This is a excellent but contentious topic! How many private land permits should be issued to the LO and to the public? In Texas the current answer is 100% and 0% but I understand the complaint that wildlife, like Bighorns, are basically state property and were reintroduced with both state and private resources. I think in Colorado the LO/public split for private land bighorn permits is 50/50 but there are new bills to move to 75/25. Here's a link: http://onyourownadventures.com/hunttalk/showthread.php?p=2432930#post2432930 50/50,or 60/40 would both be a good plan. I dont want to take the LO tags or the finacial incentive provided to land owners away completely, just make the system a little more fair It's funny you read that and find out that some of those Ranches paid 100% of the cost associated with building a big horn sheep herd from scratch and now every one wants access to those tags...... Those ranches paid 100% of all costs.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Nogalus Prairie]
#6008419
11/03/15 04:52 PM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,210
LuckyHunter
Veteran Tracker
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Veteran Tracker
Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,210 |
There are usually 8-12 LO tags per year. They fluctuate in price with the economy but have been running about $80-85K the past few years.
Seems kind of silly to say but in the world of Desert Bighorn hunting that is the best bang for your buck going today considering the quality of rams Texas consistently produces. You can get some Mexico hunts in the 50-60K range but the quality overall on those hunts cannot match Texas'. There are big rams in Mexico (Tiburon Island, Carmen Island, etc) but those hunts are well into the six figures.
The man to call if you want access to a prime LO tag and guide who knows his stuff on TX Desert Bighorn hunting is Larry Altimus. Just Google Altimus Adventures. Pretty sure there is a 3-4 year backlog on tag availability. AGREED contact Larry
Lucky 7 Exotic Ranch located in Eden, Tx. Well managed self sustaining herds roaming our 3,000 acre ranch. First Class Lodging, Ranch style meals and qualified guides. 30+ species.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: BOBO the Clown]
#6008428
11/03/15 04:58 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,757
Rob Lay
Pro Tracker
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Posts: 1,757 |
They aren't forced they opted for that via entering unit wide tag drawning.
same thing, if you want to privately take Pronghorn you have to allow public to take some too.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Rob Lay]
#6008436
11/03/15 05:03 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637 |
They aren't forced they opted for that via entering unit wide tag drawning.
same thing, if you want to privately take Pronghorn you have to allow public to take some too. From my understanding it two separate systems. Large ranch- Ranch specific tag vs Small ranch Unit wide tag. Unit wide tag drawing makes your ranch open to public access if you enter the drawing.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: BOBO the Clown]
#6008451
11/03/15 05:14 PM
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Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,757
Rob Lay
Pro Tracker
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Pro Tracker
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Posts: 1,757 |
From my understanding it two separate systems. Large ranch- Ranch specific tag vs Small ranch Unit wide tag. Unit wide tag drawing makes your ranch open to public access if you enter the drawing. when I hunted there with Wildlife Systems all the clients hunted on single ranch that was leased from owner. we had to deal with public hunters and the public hunters got first opportunity. maybe land owner can get a minimum amount of tags without allowing public, only when you want more for an outfitter it requires you also do public.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: fishdog]
#6008461
11/03/15 05:17 PM
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,210
LuckyHunter
Veteran Tracker
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Joined: Dec 2012
Posts: 2,210 |
It took 3 pages before "exotics" were injected into this post which had nothing to due with "exotics". Next time let's go for 4,5,6
Last edited by SheepHunter; 11/03/15 05:18 PM.
Lucky 7 Exotic Ranch located in Eden, Tx. Well managed self sustaining herds roaming our 3,000 acre ranch. First Class Lodging, Ranch style meals and qualified guides. 30+ species.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Rob Lay]
#6008466
11/03/15 05:20 PM
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637
BOBO the Clown
kind of a big deal
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kind of a big deal
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 60,637 |
From my understanding it two separate systems. Large ranch- Ranch specific tag vs Small ranch Unit wide tag. Unit wide tag drawing makes your ranch open to public access if you enter the drawing. when I hunted there with Wildlife Systems all the clients hunted on single ranch that was leased from owner. we had to deal with public hunters and the public hunters got first opportunity. maybe land owner can get a minimum amount of tags without allowing public, only when you want more for an outfitter it requires you also do public. Was your tag ranch specific or unit specific?
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: LuckyHunter]
#6008806
11/03/15 08:07 PM
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091
Nogalus Prairie
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 27,091 |
It took 3 pages before "exotics" were injected into this post which had nothing to due with "exotics". Next time let's go for 4,5,6 therancher did so, not me. Trophy animals from "all over the world". Just to make the record clear in case there was any confusion. Carry on.
I learned long ago you can't reason someone out of something they don't reason themselves into.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: fishdog]
#6008883
11/03/15 08:39 PM
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,099
TTT Ranch
Pro Tracker
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Pro Tracker
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 1,099 |
My mothers side of my family has gotten a LO tag almost every year for the past 8 years. One guy bought the tag a few years ago and wounded one that was never found so he bought the tag the next year and got one.
Last edited by David Taylor Construction; 11/03/15 08:43 PM.
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: Nogalus Prairie]
#6008917
11/03/15 08:54 PM
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296
stxranchman
Obie Juan Kenobi
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Obie Juan Kenobi
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 60,296 |
I don't even get your point unless you are trying to start a debate on some other subject. There's no "spin". The U.S. and state conservation agencies are charged with re-populating and managing native animals. They don't have anything to do with exotics.
How many states do you think regulate or have had seasons on introduced "exotics"? Some even have limited annual draws and seasons still today on "exotics".
Are idiots multiplying faster than normal people?
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Re: Texas Desert Bighorn landowner tags
[Re: fishdog]
#6008977
11/03/15 09:18 PM
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Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 21,271
SniperRAB
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Mar 2012
Posts: 21,271 |
I am still trying to figure out what a "Artificial WT" is
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