Have a difference of opionion here at the office. Will a spike always be a spike forever?

It depends on the age of the deer. If the deer is older than 2.5 and still a spike it will usually stay a spike. If it is 1.5 years old it can still grow bigger.

Thanks, I was beginning to think this was a dumb question. Lts of looks but no replies.

90 percent of the time......a spike is always a spike

Also once a buck sheds his antlers he begins to build up fat and muscle through the spring/summer and extra protein and nutrients goes to antler growth. Genetics is very important also. A bucks first priority is to build up strength for his body then grow his antlers.

This is why high fenced, very strict management, suplemtial feeding, extra protein will allow them to grow huge racks.

So in short, a spike this season should not be a spike next season unless spring is very dry and a hot dry summer. I agree that a 2.5 yr old with spikes needs to be put in a freezer, but the 1.5 yr old with a good set of forks or even 6/7 total points should not be shot, he has potential.

I ain't sure about that 90% of the time, but, a spike at 1.5 y.o. is suspect.

At 2.5 if only one or neither antler has formed a branch, it probably needs to be taken out of the herd.

From the stuff I learned down at the Kerr WMA, a spike at 1.5 does have the posiblity of producing branched antlers at some point in its life, but even if or when it does, they will be inferior to other bucks of that same age class that had branched antlers at 1.5.

I heard a Parks and Wildlife genetics guy speak who said a spike may not always be a spike but he will never be a significant buck. He may grow into a 6 point but he will never be a good 6 point. He said shoot every spike you see and keep the turnover of does, the mamas of those spikes, happening.

The Kerr study was both wrong and right. It depends on your point of view. They considered a buck grown at 3.5 years of age. At that age the bucks which had spike horns at 1.5 were still smaller then the bucks that had branched antlers at 1.5, BUT here's the twist at 4.5 and up there appears to be no significant difference in the average antler size. In other words the spike bucks had caught up at that age. If your goal is to produce the biggest deer possible at 3.5 then yearly spikes are a bad deal, if you are just trying to produce the largest free ranging mature buck (4.5+) then shooting yearling spike will just hurt your cause by reducing the total number of bucks that you have.

-john

FA, to some extent I agree, but from what my lying eyes have shown me is that on young bucks (1.5) there is way too much of a variation from year to year in the groceries available to momma while she is pregnant, the groceries available to her while she is nursing, and too much of a variable as to what's available after the little guy is weaned.

If it is a dry year and he's a spike then he may never turn out as well as others in his age group because he was behind the 8 ball even while he was in the womb.

That is one of the most valuable parts of supplementing with protein. If momma is getting good groceries (adequate nutrition) then when he hits the ground, he is already one step ahead. If his body is getting everything it needs to grow according to nature's clock then the extra goes to his head gear. If he's struggling just to survive then there isn't anything to add to his antler's.

It isn't just about protein levels or a calcium to phospherous ration. It's about the other minerals he needs to make his body function at optimum levels also.

Now if his sorry little butt is still a spike at 3.5 then there isn't much hope and he's eating stuff that would benefit another deer more. JMO

I agree with deerfeeder. I have seen spikes at 1.5 years grow into good bucks. The majority of them either were born in a bad year, were born late, or sometimes to does that were young or thin themselves and didn't have much milk. The study at Kerr is mostly done in pens that feed differing amounts of protein pellets to the bucks. That is a good way to evaluate deer on the differing amounts of feed and what it does to growth, but it still is different than growing up in the wild without supplement feed.

I just watched a hunting program last week where they charted a buck's life on a ranch from yearling thru his death at age 11. He started as a spike and in year six was a 176 inch 10 point. Then went down hill from there back to a 115 inch 8 at age 10. A yearling spike can grow into about anything if given the chance per this biologist. I went to Dr. Deer's seminar a few years back at the TTHA Extravaganza in Fort Worth and he said the same thing.
Just thought I'd share......

IMO, this is the exact reason to base your culling on age, not horn size. If you are culling BUCKS, then shoot the deer that are older and have less than 8 points, those 1.5 year old spikes are not going to breed neer as many does as 1 thinks he will, as well, you never know what he may turn into next year.
Like most everyone else states, a spike is not always a spike.

If its a spike at 2.5 we take it regardless. I believe a 1.5 y/o spike can still grow to be something. We will have too many 2.5 y/o that are not spikes and have good antlers already. I agree with the fact that he may not always be a spike but imo he wont be what 9+ pt 2.5 y/o deer will be in two more years.

at either 1.5 or 2.5 they aren't breeding so why not give them another year and see what they turn out to, whats it going to hurt. Shot a doe instead

Once a spike always a spike. They just get uglier and beat up on the good bucks. At best they become good cull bucks. I say shoot em all.

I have a friend who owns a game ranch where they have already killed 196, 186, 183 inch deer this year. He paid big money for a yearling buck out of Kansas for a potential breeder buck. The first three sets of antlers were spikes and his fourth set scored 167. I understand its a high fence ranch and they get plenty of feed but that pretty much eliminates the once a spike always a spike theory for me. There is probably alot of truth to the fact that those deer may take several years to catch up to the other deer his age and a greater possibility of being an inferior deer.

We've got a deer on our place I know was a spike last year. He's a nice wide 6point this year. I know it's the same deer because last year he was limping on his right front leg, and the lower joint was swelled up. This year he's not limping on it, but the knot is still on his leg, and he's sporting much better headgear. We expect good things from him next year. He's charmed too. Not only did he survive the injury, he also survived a bow shot from a rookie this year too. He flat missed him. I was glad, but don't tell anyone I said that.

The average deer harvested inour area is 3.5 yrs. These deer will never live six years even if no one shoots them. what I see is these deer with nasty racks will fight off the nice bucks with the symetrical racks. So if I don't take these bucks out of the herd my trophy bucks have a less chance to breed the good does.

This is one of those can-o-worms with no definite proof for either side. I say if "once/Always" were true then in AR counties we should be seeing some seriously old spikes in the next year or two. I personally have never seen a spike that was more than 1.5 or so.

I think that range conditions, herd size, and other living factors have a lot to do with what headgear a deer produces. If I can take a first year spike, pen him up and feed him till he pukes with protien and he produces a good rack the second year (as in the high fence examples) then he will not always be a spike.

Genetically inferior probably, always a spike NO.

"once a spike always a spike" is clearly not true. I believe the studies on this, and I have observed this firsthand for years as well. I rarely see a 2.5 yo spike, and none this year even though we had several 1.5 yo spikes last year. To take or not to take a spike will simply be an individual decision. We let them live at 1.5, because several factors besides genetics can factor into antlers at this stage. We evaluate culling starting at 2.5. But that's just our view.

Mississippi State University has been doing research on deer a long time. They have the racks off the deer they have in the pens. Many, many deer started as spikes and grew into very impressive trophy class bucks (some even B&C).

Saying a spike will always be a spike is a ridiculous statement that just isn't true. My opinion only!