First, I'm new rifles and hunting. Unfortunately, my dad hates guns, but now that I have young boys I want to introduce them to hunting. I'm trying to learn as much as a I can.

I'm looking at either a Ruger American or Remington 700 ADL. Academy has the 700 on sale, and it's right about the same price as the American. What are the pro's and con's of each? As a newbie, any suggestions on what I should be looking for?

Also - 270, 30-06, 7mm, etc? What are the pro's and con's of each caliber? I'm leaning towards a 270 because I think that would be plenty for deer and hog. But for actual hunting, is there some drawbacks to it?

Rem 700 ADL in 270 is perfectly fine. Don't limit yourself to a long action. Being a new shooter a lower recoil short action is where I would point you. A Remington, Savage, or Tikka in 7mm-08 is hard to beat!

Winchester Model 70 in .270 - fine for most Texas deer, plenty for hogs, recoil manageable for young shooters, accuracy and slickest bolt for the price in any rifle. What do you mean "actual hunting"?

I agree with Fireman. One thing I will add though is go to your local walmart and see what is readily available on the shelf in term of ammo. The best advice I like to give new rifle shooters is choose something that is easy on the wallet and easy to find. When you start out, more important than the actual make of the rifle is having somehting you will shoot regularly. In today's market, it's easier to name off rifle that you shouldn't buy. Being objective and unbiased, most are fairly good rifles.

My son's first rifle was the Weatherbey Vanguard S2 in .308. I don't know if it is the stock design, recoil pad or ???, but it is the softest recoiling "serious" caliber rifle I have shot. My Rem 700 in 30-06, Rem 7400 (semi) in .270, and even our 30-30's seem to have much more recoil. That Weatherby S2 reminds me more f the recoil on a Savage .243 my youngest son shoots.

Also, the last few Rem 700 bolts I actioned at Walmart and at cabellas last spring were horribly rough compared to Ruger American, Savage, my old school Rem BDL, Weatherby Vamguard, etc. maybe those were just a bad run, but ont buy a gun based on name / reputation if the bolt isn't also super slick!

270 would be great, even though I don't own one.
7mm-08 or 308 would be great in a short action.

Welcome to the idea of Big Game Hunting. Depending on your level of interest & usage amount, size of your wallet, and need for peer approval ... you will find a comfort zone in almost any of the suggestions you've already received.

So, what constitutes the parameters of your decision making process based on the above mentioned 3 factors is strictly your decision, and how much weight you impart to each factor + whatever others also affect your decision.

One of the comments above I really like was KR's concerns about the ready availability of ammo, even during Buying Panics like we are just coming out of.

Rifles: I'd suggest you think in Levels of Features X's Price. You can spend beaucoup bux, or a bare minimum, and successfully kill critters in Texas at the "Normal Hunting Ranges" of 75-150/200 yards max the rest of your life with a Rig that cost you under $500...or not have enough features on a Rig at $5000 to satisify some of us who will espose an Opinion here...it really can be a Pandora's Box of confusing decisions if you let it.
With the Scot's - Hebrew soul I have, I always look at how much can I get for what I am buying if I want out of the deal later...Hunting Rifles are the same way, and makes me tend not to buy Gimmicks or the The Hot New Thing. Price per Value Received is what I'm always concerned with.

NIB Rifles general price points: I'd suggest @ Under $400 a Ruger American, under $500 a Savage, under $600 a Ruger 77 Hawkeye, Weatherby Vanguard S2 or Tikaa T3 Blue/synthetic stock, under $700 a Tikka T3 SS/synthetic stock, under $800 a CZ 550 American, under $900 a Winchester M70 Featherweight and so on. You will note I have omitted Remington totally ... and that is not by accident. I am not a fan of Remington like most folks are, and most especially in any of their lower price point current production rifles being sold in the big Box Retailers as a Promotional Product. Remmy's upper grade quality items are better guns that you have to pay for, but at those higher prices I beleive there are better choices elsewhere.

** FWIW Rifles that "fit" you will always shoot better and are easier to learn on. Handle and shoulder everything as if you were looking at a Whopper just about to get away. Close your eyes, mount the rifle correctly with your feet in the right position...and open your eyes to see if your sight picture w/or w/out a scope is where it is supposed to be. Do this enough and one or another brand rifle will "speak" to you I am the THE One for you.

Scopes: JG Fireman's frequent comments about the quality of rifles in the market today are sufficiently accurate despite the variance in price points, and that the biggest difference in On Target Performance these days is in Scopes...and I tend to agree with him. Todays Scopes are the cheapest way to upgrade a Hunting Rig.

I'll leave that selection discussion to others, but I've been and am satified with several lower price point scopes like the Burris FF II 3x9x40 at around $200 as my "default" selection for your performance parameters, and especially for the under 200-300 yrd max shots I've killed 95% of my Big Game critters at from Texas to the Rockies. I'd look to spend a bout half of my total purchase on Good Glass instead of the 1/3 scope 2/3's rifle formula I used to use.

Calibers: Since you need to practice & learn how to shoot accurately probably more than someone who has hunted with a CenterFire Rifle all their life, the price & access of ammo should be of a major concern to you. Check all the Hunting Ad's for ammo prices and you will see the same 4 calibers over and over as the Price Competion items from the Big 3 Ammo Brands in 243, 270, 308**, 30'06 and/or 30-30 & 7Rmg & 300WMg as needed to hunt successfully on Texas sized critters at under 300 yards...much less half that distance where most of us hunt if we were to be completely honest about the majority of our kill shots being taken at Deer & Hogs. IMO you do NOT need a Magnum Rifle caliber to hunt with in Texas....even though I have shot more than a few magnums over tha last 40 years, usually for longer shots on bigger Critters & I own another one right now, they have never been my Primary Hunting Tool. FWIW just as KR said about access to ammo, 308 & 223 sold out 1st during the Panic and are still very limited in inventory for most retailers for a complete choice of bullets. Again personal perspective from personal experience is more Opinion than Fact on Killing Performance. IE A Dead deer is a Dead Deer whether it was killed by a 308 or a 300Magnum...the remaining piece of meat you pick up though could be a totally different story.

So IMO... The easy, middle of the road choice for the most commonly available & cheapest caliber do all for everything caliber in Texas is the 270 WCF for a One Gun Hunter, other calibers are the same way other places and IMO 30'06, 308 or 7-08 are equally acceptable for hunting anything anywhere if one of those satisfies one of your 3 prerequisites. As far as a 7-08 - I'd pick this caliber as my 2nd overall choice ...it's ammo is a bit more pricy but an excellent choice. I hear it referred to elsewhere sometimes as a "270Short" performance wise.

I am not a big fan of the 243 except for experienced shooters who can more than likely always put the bullet where it needs to go with the larger margin of error in acceptable performance success it has, but it is constantly touted primarily these days for it's low recoil instead of the end all combo Varmint & WTail caliber for a One Gun Hunter like it was when I bought my 1st one in 1969, and is supposed to be equal to any of the new Long Action Low Recoil selections in better bigger calibers... that a 243 however IS NOT equal to in terminal performance, and that will get me flamed but it is my perspective from my personal experiences over 40+ years of deer hunting. Everybodies got a nose and an Opinion and that's as it should be.

Have fun, shop hard, listen and learn from anyone who has an opinion ...that at least has some gray in his beard.
Ron

700 ADL in 308 Win. Ammo is much cheaper, more variety, common bolt face and the 700 is good because there are copious upgrades for it.

Thanks for the replies.

I don't have a ton of money right now (too many other hobbies), so I specifically mentioned the 700 ADL and American because that's the price point I can afford.

I've also started pricing out ammo, because as a few mentioned, that can be a factor when getting used to a new gun. I anticipate having to visit the range a quite a few times, and don't want to break the bank.

Someone else mentioned recoil, and that's a factor - both because I'm a new hunter and because my 14 year old (5'8" 145 lbs)may also use this gun. I have a Mosin we picked up for cheap, and that recoils like a Mack truck! Thought we would use that to hunt, but by the time I buy a sight, mount, etc, I figured for not much more I can get a modern rifle that's more accurate right out of the box.

This week I'll go handle a few, and see how they fit.

Based on your criteria I would go with the Remington in a 270 and you will need to top it off with a medium quality variable Bushnell scope.You can get someone to mount the scope and bore sight the rifle for you ...Then go to the range and sight her in ...Then back to the range back to the range Etc! Etc!

Mosin with a slip on butpad would be a good extra rifle with iron sights for up to 150 yards. that what mine is good for. I would save up for something worthwhile in the other rifle. there are some threads already running with this subject one with a budget of 500 or less

As far as managing recoil, both the 270 & 30'06 have Reduced Recoil ammo ...and Umm mebbe the 7-08 & 308's too.

Good idea about the Slip On pad for the Mosin for this year....and shoot the Iron sights until you can get bux to get into something better.

I'd also suggest shopping the used racks early next spring and see what you can pick up after deer season is over. OBTW No fly's on a good used Marlin 336 30-30 for shots out to 150 yards or so & same idea to start with irons if necessary and ammo is mo cheap too...with good to excellent resale from the used prices. Be sure to buy a Pre Remington mfg'ed gun as they have the best value and craftsmanship.

We all have to start somewhere...the trick is to not make too many mistakes that wind up costing you money to recover from and buy the best quality possible with the best resale so you can turn the rifle into trade bait or cash back to invest in a better value upgrade rifle later down the road...or not if you are satisfied. I waited 5 years after I bought my 1st Good Rifle before I cahnged guns again,meanwhile I swapped off the sporterized milsurp Springfield 30'06 I bought initially on a shotgun.

On "another channel" yesterday I saw a NIB Burris 3x9x40 still in shrink wrap for just under $150 shipped that would cost you NIB at retail around $200+. One of the guys on here found a cherry Wood/Blue M700 ADL 30'06 in a pawn shop this summer for around $300 that made back when Remmy made better stuff than they do today...and even I would have jumped on that one from the pics he posted. Keep shopping hands on, and on Gun Broker to see prices and pics, and you'll get a feel for what you want.
Ron

well I have shot weapons all my life but bought my 1st bolt action deer rifle at 33 yo to use and share with my boys that were still in single digit ages and I settled on a 243 for the TX whitetail later gave it to one of my boys(I wish I kept it) I like the common calibers and 243/270/308 but I would not be sad about a 7-08.

Since you have young boys that are going to want to shot also 7-08 or 243

I would have to agree with wileycoyote 1st post, especially the 243. Reasons for that are close to the same but in addition being new your tracking skills might not be up to par. How old are your boys? I suggest that you look into reloading as well, if not then stay with the 260 or 7-08. If a decision to reload is made then the 06. It can be reduced to 30-30 levels with 30-30 designed bullets very easily for recoil, practice, and harvest and then it can be loaded to max to be (debatable just shy of a century) second to none before the magnum cartridge loadings. Especially in all perspective data from ballistics to game harvest in all of the scenarios of hunting.

In my opinion this is the absolute best deal you can find on a new gun. I have one in 22-250 that puts five shots (handloads) inside a dime. The scope it comes with is not too bad but I would replace the mounts with Talleys. The 243 will give you the capacity to kill anything in Texas and the recoil is not too bad for kids. I had the ADL in 243 and it was fine but like the Savage better and it already has a Nikon scope.

http://grabagun.com/firearms/rifles/bolt-action-rifles/savage-11thxp-pkg-243win-22-bl-syn.html

No one makes a rifle with greater "out of the box" accuracy than Remington. And the .270 is one of the most popular deer hunting rounds. You can also reduce the recoil for younger shooters by using Remington Managed Recoil ammo. It's also great for older farts like me. The MR ammo produces less recoil than a .243. It can be harder to find and cost more, but is worth the price because of the "comfort" it provides the shooter.

All in all, the .270 and some MR ammo for the boys gives you a rifle that will always fit the entire family.

Edited for accuracy.

I second that.

The guns you have listed are good hunting guns in a good choice of calibers. I personally would suggest a 243 only because as a beginner the 243 has less recoil and is much easier to practice with. 20 Rounds of 30-06 or 270 off a bench will add up quickly. While 20 rounds of 243 is a walking the park.

Otherwise, welcome and enjoy...

Tikka T3 in 243 or 7-08 gets my vote.

I third that.

Forget about a new 700. Remington got bought out a few years ago and their new stuff is the worst they've put out in 40 years. Pretty much anything else in the same price range is superior. Ruger is supposedly decent, but I'd definitely vote for a Savage above either Ruger or Remington. I, like the OP, have had good luck with those two brands over the years. But IMHO, the guns you're looking at are not the best options in that price range.

Let me clarify - my oldest boy is 14 and he's almost as strong as I am. He can shoot the Mosin just fine (with a slip-on pad), so I know he can handle recoil from 270 or bigger.

Unfortunately I haven't gotten to the store to take a look, but doing some late night research, the Savage has caught my eye. But what's the difference between the 111 and the 11? I looked on the Savage site, but it wasn't really obvious to me. There seems to be a price difference.

Also, any reputable gun shops (other than the big box stores) in the DFW area that are worth visiting?

EDIT: So is the Savage 11 and 111 the same thing? Appears so from this: http://www.gandermountain.com/modperl/product/details.cgi?i=617183

If so, that's right smack in my price range, and maybe the rifle to go with.

Savage 10, 11, and 12, are short action .223 and .308 bolt face, and parent cartridges. .223, 22-250, 243, 6.5 Creedmoor, 260 Rem, 7mm-08, 308 Win

Savage 110, and 111 are long action. 30-06 based cartridges (30-06 and 270 for example) and magnum bolt face cartridges (7 Rem Mag, and 300 Win Mag for example)

Just to add, between all the calibers based on 308 (22-250, 243, 260 rem, and 7mm-08; and the 30-06 (25-06; 280; 270 win) will all kill anything in Texas with the right bullet. (basically the deer head on the box of ammo). The 308 based are a little shorter and don't need as long of a barrel; the 30-06 based cartridges have a little more case capacity and velocity which equate to a little less drop.


And just about any off the rack rifle is going to be at least 1.5-2.5 MOA, which will all kill animals with boring regularity.