Well, first of all, I have a great wife because she gave me the green light to get a really nice birthday present for myself since I'll be turning 40 for the 20th time. Stumbled on to a good deal on a Remington 5R in 308 and will pick it up tomorrow (Monday). It comes with a 6-24x50 Vortex Viper PST (FFP with the EBR-1 MRAD reticle) sitting on top, both just a little over a year old. It has 110 shells down the pipe, so it's nicely broken in.

It seems like most 5R owners use them for long range bench shooting, but I want it to be my long range rifle to take to a deer stand that might call for shots up to 400 yards. I rarely shoot beyond 175, but I think this rifle will give me the confidence to stretch out further. I do have a couple of questions out there for any of you that hunt with either the 5R or that Vortex.

5R owners -- For hunting purposes (not bench shooting), what shells seem to work best for you? Because of all the great reviews, I am thinking Barnes with the 150 grain TSSX bullets.

For ballistics experts -- What impact will the higher rate of twist (I think it's 1 in 11.5 instead of the typical 1 in 8 or 1 in 10) have on my choice of hunting shells?

For Viper PST owners --- the scope on it seems better suited for just shooting paper instead of deer/hogs. Comments/Experiences regarding suitability for hunting purposes? (Think I'd rather put a 4.5-14 Zeiss Conquest on it).

Thanks for you advice.

Hornady TAP 168 grain

I run a Leupold Mark 4, illuminated reticle 4.5x14x50

I shot some 168 gr Hornady through my 5R and it didn't do too bad. Still breaking in my barrel now.

I just ordered some 165 gr Nosler Accubonds and plan to hunt with these.

Mine is topped with a Swarovski 4-12x50 Z3.

this

Have the Zeiss on mine, use 168 but this sucker is heavy. Good thing on heavy is very little recoil but climbing up a ladder into blind is hard on the rifle. Kind of beats it up.
Great buy. Have fun with it.

I'll typically be at my uncle's place, so the blind is only elevated about 6 feet, so there weight won't be an issue.

What about the light gathering capacity on that PST and also the twist on that barrel? Thanks.

"For ballistics experts -- What impact will the higher rate of twist (I think it's 1 in 11.5 instead of the typical 1 in 8 or 1 in 10) have on my choice of hunting shells?"

Sorry, I'm not a balistics expert, but the rate of twist is measured in how many inches it takes for the bullet to make one revolution. That means the a 1 in ll.25 is a LOWER rate of twist than 1 in 8 or 1 in 10. The revolutions are what stabilize the bullet, and different rates of twist are ideal for stabilizing different weights and lenths of bullets. The spinning itself can cause the bullet to err in an unperfect world because of imperfections in the bullet surface when it leaves the bore as well as imperfections in the bullet's density. Therefore for accuracy purposes, there needs to be enough spin but not excessive spin. The military decided 1 in 11.25 was enough for the .308 bullet, and that is why the 5R comes in that twist ratio. What all that means in plain English, you'll probably never notice any difference between the normal 1 in 10 and the little bit slower 1 in ll...

Thanks Hermano. NOW I understand what the numbers mean as they relate to the bullet revolutions. I guess for the most part it's not a major issue since I am not shooting at 1000 yard paper targets. A 150 pound sow at 200 yards eats a lot better than paper at 600 yards!

On the same subject, the rifling itself puts imperfections on the surface of the bullet. The faster the twist, the more the surface is disrupted. Not only the twist rate, but the rifling type was taken into consideration to minimize the bullet surface distortion. That is why the 5R type of rifling was chosen. On your 200 lb sow, it makes you little difference, but if you were very likely to be killed after taking a shot at a high ranking VietCong officer, you would want your shot to have all the probability you could possibly have for that shot to hit it's mark... That's the history behind the 5R Milspec...

Did some digging and found out that the barrel rifling on the 5R was developed by a fella named Obermeyer and it's called the Obermeyer 5R process. Now available in Krieger barrels.

The last 5r I had would shoot anything you put in it and shoot it well, but my favorite was the 180 grain nosler ballistic tip.
As for the scope, I've never had a vortex but hear a lot of good about them. If you decide to replace it let me know, maybe we can make a trade on it.

bscdd --- sent you a pm.

the pst glass will do you fine in any situation.. no worries.. my 5r shoots anything i shove down it's throat very well.. i use a 168 grn amax to devastating effect.. believe me this combo over 45 grns of varget will get the job done all day. also pretty good luck w/ sierra 165 grn Gameking hpbt's

I bought my best friend a brand new 5R back in 2008. We took the rifle and hand loaded for it from day one. His gun in stupidly accurate. We shoot 175 gr. SMK over 43.5 grs. of Varget in Federal Match brass with a large rifle primer. Hitting a 10" steel gong at 720 yards is boring with his gun, it will literally do it over and over again.

I hunt and long range shoot with mine too. it really likes the 168 and 175gr SMK but I loaded up some 150gr SGK last year to hunt with and it did really well. Varget is the best powder i had luck with for all my 308's The scope thats on the gun now should be just fine for hunting also.

Thanks for all the info and advice. I'll take it to the range either tonight or tomorrow night to see how it feels and shoots. If I remember, I might take a target of my own and color it brown (to simulate a deer) to see how well that fine reticle shows up against it.

Well, took the 5R to the range Thursday night. It is definitely a shooter, 1/2 MOA with plain old factory Hornady 150 grain SSTs.

I still have mixed feelings about the Viper PST. I zoomed it up to 24 power at 100 yards and what was really cool was the FFP feature. Never looked through a FFP scope before. So the FFP eases my worries about the reticle being too fine. Is the FFP mostly a feature on tactical type scopes, or can FFP be found as an option on any of the standard "hunting" scopes?

The gun is already heavy, but I hunt primarily from a blind (box stand), so weight of the scope is not an issue. But it still just seems like too many bells and whistles for me. My use for it will by 95% hunting and 5% at the range just to make sure it is still dialed in prior to deer season. Plus all the markings on the reticle bother me. Since the combo will be used strictly for hunting purposes (50 to 200 yards) rather than shooting paper at 500 yards, I am thinking of saying bye to the Viper SST and getting something like a Zeiss Duralyt 3-12x50.

Thoughts?

On European Scopes, it is not a feature. Usually it is standard. This way the reticle is always relative to the target.

Late yesterday afternoon, I took out the rifles with the Viper SST 6-24x50, Minox 3-15x42, and Conquest 4.5-14x50 to compare. The Conquest seemed to do the best at low light, but the reticle is the most fine of the 3 and I might have trouble seeing the intersection of the crosshairs on a dark target like a black hog. The SST and the Minox seemed comparable in low light conditions. I got more used to the Viper SST and figured out some things on the illumination of the reticle and the FFP feature.

Some folks have told me to not rush and to give the Viper a chance to prove itself in hunting situations, so I think I might just hold off and hunt with it this season along with a Tikka 308/Minox combo to see how they both do. The Viper is starting to grow on me and I am hanging on to it for this season at a minimum.

I think you're making a wise decision...

Thanks Hermano. You might be right.

I found out about a range in the area where you can go 200, 300, and 400 yards. Just might need to go try shooting paper at those distances before trying to put a shell through meat at 250 or more yards.

I shoot a 168 grain Federal Premium Match King BTHP with my 5R. I have had no problem shooting groups at the range and taking larger animals.

Here's a picture of the exit wound (using the 168 grain) on a 300 lb. Aoudad I shot with one shot earlier this week at 200 yards. You can see the bullet fregmented and did it job. The ram never had a chance. If you ever hunted Aoudad, you know these animals are difficut to put down with on shot.

bummer, i saw the thread title and thought it was a For Sale thread...

Alex -- Nope. The way this 5R combo shoots, I think it has found a permanent home!