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Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: JWP58] #2995886 02/08/12 02:39 AM
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Originally Posted By: JWP58
All you're doing is trolling.

There have been thousands upon thousands of big game killed every year with the .243win. Just because your skill is inadequate, doesnt mean the cartridge is aswell.

Repeating the same $hit over and over is not making an arguement. You missed the total point that I was trying to make so go back and read the thread. Please


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: Justin T] #2995897 02/08/12 02:43 AM
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Originally Posted By: Justin T
Originally Posted By: nado2036
I need to see your numbers because that doesnt compute that they are going to have more killing power.


Let me give you a quick lesson in kinetic energy. energy = 0.5 * mass * (velocity)^2



What I was refering to was that a 90 gr bullet is not hitting harder than a 140 gr bullet when there pretty much moving the same speed. That is why I am saying that it doesnt compute. Also I do know that a bullet that exands faster the more energy it is going to deliver. Now that we have that out of the way.


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: rifleman] #2995902 02/08/12 02:43 AM
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Having studied trauma and the human body I can tell you that it's trauma that kills. Wound channels, destruction of tissue, organs, bones and the loss of blood.

Consider a VW bug moving at 15 mph versus 100 grain bullet at 3000fps. The bug, because of it's weight, will have more energy upon impact than the bullet. But given the choice, I'd rather be hit by the bug at 15 mph than the bullet at 3000fps.

There is no such thing as "knock down power". That's some hokie term coined up by some writer or marketing scheme in an ad campaign.

I forget the author, but he swore that the .220 Swift was the most perfect whitetail round ever developed. He even showed how a .220 Swift could punch holes through steel while other more popular calibers couldn't. The .220 Swift is effective because that small bullet, hitting at such hyper velocity, does so much terminal damage to the body that there's little chance of the animal surviving.

Basically, the more vital organs affected by the wound channel the less likely that an animal will survive.



Mike
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Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: rifleman] #2995904 02/08/12 02:44 AM
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Well I know a .243 will kill a hog because both my wife and myself have done it.

And a .270 and a 25-06. Now I am waiting on a chance to use my .264 Win Mag on one.

My next gun purchase is going to be a .338 Win Mag and unless I get to go elk hunting, it's sole purpose is to see if I can shoot a big hog up his bum and come out his nose. My reloading buddy is already working on recipes.



" If you can't have no fun, it ain't no use a'goin' ! " - old man in a Sweetwater , TX cafe

Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: LandPirate] #2995940 02/08/12 02:51 AM
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Originally Posted By: LandPirate
Having studied trauma and the human body I can tell you that it's trauma that kills. Wound channels, destruction of tissue, organs, bones and the loss of blood.

Consider a VW bug moving at 15 mph versus 100 grain bullet at 3000fps. The bug, because of it's weight, will have more energy upon impact than the bullet. But given the choice, I'd rather be hit by the bug at 15 mph than the bullet at 3000fps.

There is no such thing as "knock down power". That's some hokie term coined up by some writer or marketing scheme in an ad campaign.

I forget the author, but he swore that the .220 Swift was the most perfect whitetail round ever developed. He even showed how a .220 Swift could punch holes through steel while other more popular calibers couldn't. The .220 Swift is effective because that small bullet, hitting at such hyper velocity, does so much terminal damage to the body that there's little chance of the animal surviving.

Basically, the more vital organs affected by the wound channel the less likely that an animal will survive.


Well I believe there is but not shooting thru soft tissue.
To me knock down power is the big heavy guns capable of smashing heavy bones in one side and out the other and pretty much knocking the animal flat . But that's just my opinion as to what knock down is.



" If you can't have no fun, it ain't no use a'goin' ! " - old man in a Sweetwater , TX cafe

Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: LandPirate] #2995947 02/08/12 02:52 AM
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Originally Posted By: LandPirate
Having studied trauma and the human body I can tell you that it's trauma that kills. Wound channels, destruction of tissue, organs, bones and the loss of blood.

Consider a VW bug moving at 15 mph versus 100 grain bullet at 3000fps. The bug, because of it's weight, will have more energy upon impact than the bullet. But given the choice, I'd rather be hit by the bug at 15 mph than the bullet at 3000fps.

There is no such thing as "knock down power". That's some hokie term coined up by some writer or marketing scheme in an ad campaign.

I forget the author, but he swore that the .220 Swift was the most perfect whitetail round ever developed. He even showed how a .220 Swift could punch holes through steel while other more popular calibers couldn't. The .220 Swift is effective because that small bullet, hitting at such hyper velocity, does so much terminal damage to the body that there's little chance of the animal surviving.

Basically, the more vital organs affected by the wound channel the less likely that an animal will survive.

My comments were in reaction to yours. So looking at the ballistics that YOU put up your going to tell me that the 90gr round is better than the 140 gr round on any given animal???


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: nado2036] #2995966 02/08/12 02:59 AM
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No, I'm telling you that the disruption and destruction of bodily functions and organs is what kills. A 90g bullet is very capable of causing the damage necessary to kill pigs. So is a 140g. bullet.

The main difference is that the 140g bullet will penetrate deeper, thereby causing a deeper wound channel and disrupting more organ systems, causing more internal damage and bleeding.

Just how dead to you want that pig? Dead is dead. Doesn't matter it got there.



Mike
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Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: Bobby B] #2995967 02/08/12 02:59 AM
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While I partially agree with your statement Bobby B , I use a 55 grain factory Remington in my .223 and it with a high point of the shoulder shot it knocks deer off of there feet with no pass thru dead right there. That is knock down power also by your definition without a big heavy gun.



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Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: stxranchman] #2995996 02/08/12 03:08 AM
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Ballistics Table in Yards
sst 90 gr., .250 B.C. www.hornady.com
Range (yards) Muzzle 50 100 200 300 400 500
Velocity (fps) 3500 3287 3084 2705 2356 2034 1740
Energy (ft.-lb.) 2448 2159 1900 1462 1109 827 605
Trajectory (200 yd. zero) -1.5 0.2 1.1 0.0 -5.8 -18.0 -38.6
Come Up in MOA -1.5 -0.4 -1.0 0.0 1.9 4.3 7.4
----------------------------------------------------------------
Ballistics Table in Yards
sst 140 gr., .495 B.C. www.hornady.com
Range (yards) Muzzle 50 100 200 300 400 500
Velocity (fps) 3090 2991 2894 2707 2527 2355 2189
Energy (ft.-lb.) 2968 2781 2604 2278 1985 1723 1489
Trajectory (200 yd. zero) -1.5 0.4 1.3 0.0 -6.0 -17.5 -35.3
Come Up in MOA -1.5 -0.7 -1.3 0.0 1.9 4.2 6.7

Here is your data!!! Lets go with any yardage you want and tell me that the 90 gr round is a better round for this gun is my point. I did not say the 90 gr round will not kill the damn pig. It is just an inferior round on your table. It shoots just as flat and provides more energy upon impact. You are reading more into the question than is there dont read between the lines just read the words typed.


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: stxranchman] #2996005 02/08/12 03:11 AM
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Originally Posted By: stxranchman
While I partially agree with your statement Bobby B , I use a 55 grain factory Remington in my .223 and it with a high point of the shoulder shot it knocks deer off of there feet with no pass thru dead right there. That is knock down power also by your definition without a big heavy gun.

I have one statement slash question with you comment. Where you are shooting the target isnt there more dense flesh.For Ex bone? So the bullet is able to deliver all of the energy it has?


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: stxranchman] #2996008 02/08/12 03:11 AM
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Originally Posted By: stxranchman
While I partially agree with your statement Bobby B , I use a 55 grain factory Remington in my .223 and it with a high point of the shoulder shot it knocks deer off of there feet with no pass thru dead right there. That is knock down power also by your definition without a big heavy gun.


well..... that bullet tumbles, lol.
It's nice to know that will work for a HS shot.


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: stxranchman] #2996009 02/08/12 03:11 AM
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Originally Posted By: stxranchman
While I partially agree with your statement Bobby B , I use a 55 grain factory Remington in my .223 and it with a high point of the shoulder shot it knocks deer off of there feet with no pass thru dead right there. That is knock down power also by your definition without a big heavy gun.


I agree 100% with you on that and thought about it when I was posting. I was mainly talking out loud. I do that sometimes.

Point is, there is such a thing as knock down power.



" If you can't have no fun, it ain't no use a'goin' ! " - old man in a Sweetwater , TX cafe

Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: stxranchman] #2996031 02/08/12 03:18 AM
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Good Lord,,never heard so much BS in my life.
Some of you could argue about a sunny day.

Is a 243 a good cartridge? hell its a GREAT cartridge and the one that will be on my back here in a few miuntes when I walk out the door to jump on the quad to check the first calf heifers.
Will it kill a hog? ahy heck yes it will and do a really fine jof of it.
Is it the best caliber if you are wanting to recover said hog? heck no it aint, but I have killed more than I can remember with one and it is capable in spades,,but if you want to recover your prize for the church BBQ you better be a tad more careful where you place your little pill.
And as for the 270 deal with 90 grainers, I have shot enough of them to know that they will kill like the hammer of Thor as long as you once again realize that there ain't no free lunch.
Is 140 grainer a better choice? well yes it is except for the fun value.
The 90 grainer is just fun, no recoil and shoots reaally fast and flat out to 250 yards.
What I love them for is that they reduce the amount you need to lead on running game such as coyotes and yes piggies.
After some distance a heavier bullet with a better BC will over take it.
Big deal, they work if stuck in the ribs like you set a bomb off inside of them.
If however I had only one choice for day in and day out and I wanted to actually bring the bacon home, well then they are not the best choice.
So much for my opinions, but one thing that I will say is a straight up fact is that the 243 is a GREAT caliber.
And if plunked in a vital area will bring them down whether it is a pig, or a hog, or an elk or a black bear.
It is the best round for all the above? well if you close your eyes and yank the trigger on anythign bigger then yes it is.

Easy to shoot, usually really accurate, hit harder than their size should allow, a killer in the right hands.
Just don't plan on a good blood trail from an exit because it is not designed for that.
Unless of course you shoot the barnes, and yes that takes it into a different category as a game getter for folks who want to actually collect their game.



America is at that awkward stage. It's too late to work within the system, but too early to shoot the bastards. Claire Wolfe
Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: Bobby B] #2996058 02/08/12 03:25 AM
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Originally Posted By: Bobby B
Originally Posted By: stxranchman
While I partially agree with your statement Bobby B , I use a 55 grain factory Remington in my .223 and it with a high point of the shoulder shot it knocks deer off of there feet with no pass thru dead right there. That is knock down power also by your definition without a big heavy gun.


I agree 100% with you on that and thought about it when I was posting. I was mainly talking out loud. I do that sometimes.

Point is, there is such a thing as knock down power.


Negative Ghost Rider.

A high shoulder shot is effective because of the immediate disruption of the deer's central nervous system. Again, this totally relates to the wound channel.

If you shot the same deer with the same rifle/round in the guts chances are pretty good that it's going to run off. The deer is hit with the same force and energy but in a less effective location.



Mike
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Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: wchamilton] #2996072 02/08/12 03:29 AM
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Originally Posted By: wchamilton
Good Lord,,never heard so much BS in my life.
Some of you could argue about a sunny day.

Is a 243 a good cartridge? hell its a GREAT cartridge and the one that will be on my back here in a few miuntes when I walk out the door to jump on the quad to check the first calf heifers.
Will it kill a hog? ahy heck yes it will and do a really fine jof of it.
Is it the best caliber if you are wanting to recover said hog? heck no it aint, but I have killed more than I can remember with one and it is capable in spades,,but if you want to recover your prize for the church BBQ you better be a tad more careful where you place your little pill.
And as for the 270 deal with 90 grainers, I have shot enough of them to know that they will kill like the hammer of Thor as long as you once again realize that there ain't no free lunch.
Is 140 grainer a better choice? well yes it is except for the fun value.
The 90 grainer is just fun, no recoil and shoots reaally fast and flat out to 250 yards.
What I love them for is that they reduce the amount you need to lead on running game such as coyotes and yes piggies.
After some distance a heavier bullet with a better BC will over take it.
Big deal, they work if stuck in the ribs like you set a bomb off inside of them.
If however I had only one choice for day in and day out and I wanted to actually bring the bacon home, well then they are not the best choice.
So much for my opinions, but one thing that I will say is a straight up fact is that the 243 is a GREAT caliber.
And if plunked in a vital area will bring them down whether it is a pig, or a hog, or an elk or a black bear.
It is the best round for all the above? well if you close your eyes and yank the trigger on anythign bigger then yes it is.

Easy to shoot, usually really accurate, hit harder than their size should allow, a killer in the right hands.
Just don't plan on a good blood trail from an exit because it is not designed for that.
Unless of course you shoot the barnes, and yes that takes it into a different category as a game getter for folks who want to actually collect their game.


Thank you


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: nado2036] #2996110 02/08/12 03:40 AM
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Originally Posted By: nado2036
Originally Posted By: stxranchman
While I partially agree with your statement Bobby B , I use a 55 grain factory Remington in my .223 and it with a high point of the shoulder shot it knocks deer off of there feet with no pass thru dead right there. That is knock down power also by your definition without a big heavy gun.

I have one statement slash question with you comment. Where you are shooting the target isnt there more dense flesh.For Ex bone? So the bullet is able to deliver all of the energy it has?

I think it is a mute point on being able to deliver all of the energy because dead is dead when I get to the deer. I am shooting to not have to track and there is more margin of error there than the head/neck. Also I am mainly shooting does and a few cull bucks up to about 3.5 yrs of age wiith this bullet. I have also seen a man shoot a 170 lb field dressed WT with 55 grain TSX in a 22-250 thru the lungs with a complete pass thru at 160 yrds. He shot that combo on purpose to see if he could get a complete pass thru. It hit a rib square going in and going out with a normal entry hole with about a quarter size exit. At nightime so the bloodtrial was hard to follow but deer made it about 80-90 yrds. Lungs were mush. Not that I would reccomend that combo for a deer hunt with that shot but it will work. Again it is all about proper bullet and shot placement.



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Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: Nightlight] #2996117 02/08/12 03:42 AM
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Originally Posted By: Nightlight
Originally Posted By: stxranchman
While I partially agree with your statement Bobby B , I use a 55 grain factory Remington in my .223 and it with a high point of the shoulder shot it knocks deer off of there feet with no pass thru dead right there. That is knock down power also by your definition without a big heavy gun.


well..... that bullet tumbles, lol.
It's nice to know that will work for a HS shot.

I do not think it is tumbling with shot from 45 yrd to up to 250 yrds. Reaction of a deer at 45 yrd and 250 is the same. Damage inside is the same. Deer is dead the same...lol.



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Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: stxranchman] #2996152 02/08/12 03:50 AM
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I understood that round tumbles upon impact


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: LandPirate] #2996155 02/08/12 03:51 AM
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Originally Posted By: LandPirate
I forget the author, but he swore that the .220 Swift was the most perfect whitetail round ever developed. He even showed how a .220 Swift could punch holes through steel while other more popular calibers couldn't. The .220 Swift is effective because that small bullet, hitting at such hyper velocity, does so much terminal damage to the body that there's little chance of the animal surviving.



hyper velocity ? maybe inside a 100 yds them 22s shed velocity like pamela anderson sheds her clothes, quick.
at 300 yds that 22 swift is only going about 2600fps, hardly spectacular.




Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: vanguard] #2996167 02/08/12 03:53 AM
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Wow is it really 8 months untill deer season opens?? bang


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: vanguard] #2996171 02/08/12 03:54 AM
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Originally Posted By: vanguard
Originally Posted By: LandPirate
I forget the author, but he swore that the .220 Swift was the most perfect whitetail round ever developed. He even showed how a .220 Swift could punch holes through steel while other more popular calibers couldn't. The .220 Swift is effective because that small bullet, hitting at such hyper velocity, does so much terminal damage to the body that there's little chance of the animal surviving.



hyper velocity ? maybe inside a 100 yds them 22s shed velocity like pamela anderson sheds her clothes, quick.
at 300 yds that 22 swift is only going about 2600fps, hardly spectacular.


The 220 swift is badass. And will maintain velocity over 3000 fps past 300 yards, more like 3200ish.


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: Nightlight] #2996202 02/08/12 04:09 AM
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Starting to think there are alot of politicians on this forum.


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: Nightlight] #2996206 02/08/12 04:10 AM
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loser8 roflmao hammer


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: Nightlight] #2996210 02/08/12 04:11 AM
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Not going back to read this thread but judging from the first post the OP needs banned for starting another one of these threads instead of going back to one of the 2,000 just like it


Re: Hog Hunting with a .243? [Re: Dustnsand] #2996225 02/08/12 04:16 AM
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Originally Posted By: z71dustin
Not going back to read this thread but judging from the first post the OP needs banned for starting another one of these threads instead of going back to one of the 2,000 just like it

I will help you out because the Op was me. I took this off one of the other 2,000 threads because some of these threads are started by people that are actually wanting some information. Instead of giving an informative answer they put up an opinion. Yes I was definately stirring and its amazing how much people read in what they want to hear or just dont read the posts they are replying to. Rather comical


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