Sounds as if a little THF shooting match might be in order one could clean or not let the targets do the talking.

Sounds as if a little THF shooting match might be in order one could clean or not let the targets do the talking.

Guess you missed mine, some shoot better dirty some shoot better clean, your rifle do it your way, nobody cares.
Guess you missed my point you can find a so called expert to support your opinions on any subject, doesn't make any of them right or wrong. Just more opinions to sift through.

No I didn't miss your post about the "experiment" you did. It's just your opinion on what you found on your rifles, so what. I try not to refute others opinions, opinions are not fact they are one's own theories on a subject.

Matching wits with you? I have better things to do than match wits with an IRE (internet rifle expert) there is no point in me trying match wits against the witless.
The only thing you prove is how far you're willing to go to publicly make an arse of yourself.

We start at 200m standing and go to 500m prone. All shots will be unsupported.


I have to ask why if the point is to determine rifle accuracy not that of the shooter looks as if the more variables you can eliminate the better the data. I would suggest a concrete bench with a good rest to test the rifle not the shooter

Rustler 11/10/10 11:07am

I don't think a person is lazy because they dont clean their rifle to someone else's standards.
How ever you chose to maintain your rifles is up to you.

Seems my factory barrels like to be dirty, the high end ones like to be clean.

If you clean one correctly there is no way to damage anything or wear out the bore by properly maintaining it.


Lack of proper maintenance sure makes buying a good used firearm harder to do.

Empirical data is just a fancy way of saying data collected from observation and measurement.
So no, empirical data is no better than any other kind of data, all data can be skewed and frequently is to show validity to whatever side of an issue one wants the data to show.
Reliable empirical data can be gathered by 3rd graders or anyone capable of measurement observation and recording the results.

You make it sound infallible which it is not, that is proven every time a data correction is made due to results from new data collection.
Collecting empirical data is what hand loaders do to find the best recipe for a given rifle. When an improvement is noted the results of the new data disproves the old as being accurate or the best, such is the case in all data.

Experiences with rifle accuracy vary from person to person rifle to rifle load to load.
Proved by the simplest explanation that most rifles will shoot more accurately with a certain brand, weight or type of factory ammo or a certain hand load recipe.
IMO It is rare to find any 4 different hunting rifles that shoot exactly the same under the exact same conditions with the exact same load or ammo.

Fact is the whole scientific community does not have the same opinions as you or I.
You're just being too stubborn to admit that your opinions are not fact, experts and data is readily available to prove or dis-prove anyone's side of any discussion.
I think we both know the best way to insure accuracy in any given rifle is know your rifle.

I appreciate the invite, I would be the one buying the cheeseburgers. All my rifles out shoot me, I always welcome the opportunity to receive tips / instruction / training to be more accurate any chance I get.

No point in finding an A2, I never fired one though I have fired an E1/A1 enough to last me a life time, never intend to pick up that style firearm ever again.
Peep sights are out for me, my eyesight aint what it used to be I need a scope.
I don't live near Houston, I haven't been near there in 5~7 years.

None of this has anything to do with the topic of "accuracy clean vs dirty bore"
It's just more posts from you showing your repetitive display of narrow mindedness and egotistical chest thumping.

I don't like quoting myself but my first post on this thread stated my opinion. Agree disagree makes absolutely no difference to me, after all it's just an opinion.

You all are still on this topic? Come on guys you are not snipers, do what your daddy and grandpa said and stop being lazy and give that gun a good cleaning!

Empirical data is just a fancy way of saying data collected from observation and measurement.
So no, empirical data is no better than any other kind of data, all data can be skewed and frequently is to show validity to whatever side of an issue one wants the data to show.
Reliable empirical data can be gathered by 3rd graders or anyone capable of measurement observation and recording the results.

You make it sound infallible which it is not, that is proven every time a data correction is made due to results from new data collection.

Collecting empirical data is what hand loaders do to find the best recipe for a given rifle. When an improvement is noted the results of the new data disproves the old as being accurate or the best, such is the case in all data.

Experiences with rifle accuracy vary from person to person rifle to rifle load to load.
Proved by the simplest explanation that most rifles will shoot more accurately with a certain brand, weight or type of factory ammo or a certain hand load recipe.
IMO It is rare to find any 4 different hunting rifles that shoot exactly the same under the exact same conditions with the exact same load or ammo.

Fact is the whole scientific community does not have the same opinions as you or I.
You're just being too stubborn to admit that your opinions are not fact, experts and data is readily available to prove or dis-prove anyone's side of any discussion.
I think we both know the best way to insure accuracy in any given rifle is know your rifle.

I appreciate the invite, I would be the one buying the cheeseburgers. All my rifles out shoot me, I always welcome the opportunity to receive tips / instruction / training to be more accurate any chance I get.

No point in finding an A2, I never fired one though I have fired an E1/A1 enough to last me a life time, never intend to pick up that style firearm ever again.
Peep sights are out for me, my eyesight aint what it used to be I need a scope.
I don't live near Houston, I haven't been near there in 5~7 years.

None of this has anything to do with the topic of "accuracy clean vs dirty bore"
It's just more posts from you showing your repetitive display of narrow mindedness and egotistical chest thumping.

I don't like quoting myself but my first post on this thread stated my opinion. Agree disagree makes absolutely no difference to me, after all it's just an opinion.

I think we can agree that the guys who clean all the time are causing damage