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Re: Poachers
[Re: txhunter24]
#1595294
08/13/10 08:08 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,069
RMR
OP
Veteran Tracker
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OP
Veteran Tracker
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,069 |
It doesn't matter where you put a board with nails down. If you do it anywhere ON PURPOSE, you can still be charged with negligence I believe. Think of it this way, your own kid is playing at home and you create an unsafe environment by leaving nails sticking up in boards and allowing them to play in the area. It's the same scenario if they are left in an area on a ranch intended to harm someone regardless if no one should be in the area. It could be the GW that gets injured. I guess I'd just do it on accident then... Not only that, let your child know where not to play. Don't see why you could get in trouble for doing something like that to your property. If someone gets hurt, they should not have been tresspassing. How does that even make any sense?
The beauty of the Second Ammendment is it won't be needed until they try and take it.
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Re: Poachers
[Re: RMR]
#1595306
08/13/10 08:14 PM
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 17,721
Txduckman
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 17,721 |
Then why do we have insurance then?? There is a reason for everything.
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Re: Poachers
[Re: Txduckman]
#1595320
08/13/10 08:20 PM
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 21,617
pegasaurus
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 21,617 |
Insurance is for accidents and acts of God not gross negligence and/or intent to harm.
Last edited by pegasaurus; 08/13/10 08:21 PM.
Funny thing about getting older: Your eyesight starts getting weaker but your ability to see through people's BS gets much better.
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Re: Poachers
[Re: pegasaurus]
#1595329
08/13/10 08:25 PM
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 8,719
cameron00
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 8,719 |
Going to have to agree that setting traps is a really bad idea.
They guy you're trying to teach a lesson is going to end up owning your ranch.
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Re: Poachers
[Re: pegasaurus]
#1595331
08/13/10 08:25 PM
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 17,721
Txduckman
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 17,721 |
Insurance is for accidents and acts of God not gross negligence and/or intent to harm. Right but these guys say they just want to throw boards with nails out b/c they want to. Insurance will pay up before wasting tens of thousands from court fees unless the person dies from tenanus. lol. Anyway, it's not a good idea unless you like attorney's.
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Re: Poachers
[Re: txhunter24]
#1595500
08/13/10 09:46 PM
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 424
FISHUNTER
Bird Dog
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Bird Dog
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 424 |
If I am confronted on my property by a poacher who is armed I can exercise my right to protect myself and shoot him. (from the words of the game warden)
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Re: Poachers
[Re: Txduckman]
#1595512
08/13/10 09:51 PM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,615
MELackey
Pro Tracker
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Pro Tracker
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,615 |
Insurance is for accidents and acts of God not gross negligence and/or intent to harm. Right but these guys say they just want to throw boards with nails out b/c they want to. Insurance will pay up before wasting tens of thousands from court fees unless the person dies from tenanus. lol. Anyway, it's not a good idea unless you like attorney's. As an underwriter specializing in General liability insurance, I can say that We would fight pretty hard to deny the claim if it was an intentional / malicious act. Regarding the defense costs... Where there is no coverage, there is no duty to defend... You better believe my carriers would file for summary judgement and would get dismissed from the case PDQ. If I was you and thought I might "accidently" leave lumber laying around with nails in it, I dang sure wouldn't mention it online...
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Re: Poachers
[Re: FISHUNTER]
#1595550
08/13/10 10:07 PM
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Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 784
longone
Tracker
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Tracker
Joined: Apr 2010
Posts: 784 |
I prefer to leave No.15 Offset Bear Traps laying around..... you know @ the base of deer stands ect....
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Re: Poachers
[Re: txhunter24]
#1595553
08/13/10 10:08 PM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,069
RMR
OP
Veteran Tracker
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OP
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 2,069 |
Personally, if it were me, and someone felt the need to tresspass MY land, I would not throw down a nail strip. I'd do it differently.
The beauty of the Second Ammendment is it won't be needed until they try and take it.
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Re: Poachers
[Re: MELackey]
#1595565
08/13/10 10:16 PM
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 7,537
txhunter24
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 7,537 |
If I was you and thought I might "accidently" leave lumber laying around with nails in it, I dang sure wouldn't mention it online...
ehh. Im not worried about it. Im real forgetful and have junk all over the place so they can just take it as a friendly reminder.
Every good and perfect gift is from above . James 1:17
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Re: Poachers
[Re: MELackey]
#1595597
08/13/10 10:31 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 10,496
Halfadozen
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 10,496 |
Insurance is for accidents and acts of God not gross negligence and/or intent to harm. Right but these guys say they just want to throw boards with nails out b/c they want to. Insurance will pay up before wasting tens of thousands from court fees unless the person dies from tenanus. lol. Anyway, it's not a good idea unless you like attorney's. As an underwriter specializing in General liability insurance, I can say that We would fight pretty hard to deny the claim if it was an intentional / malicious act. Regarding the defense costs... Where there is no coverage, there is no duty to defend... You better believe my carriers would file for summary judgement and would get dismissed from the case PDQ. If I was you and thought I might "accidently" leave lumber laying around with nails in it, I dang sure wouldn't mention it online... So I guess an electric fence would fall under the same category? Even if it was posted. So if someone didn't have livestock but put up an electric fence anyway. That's an "intentional" act.
Last edited by gljshh; 08/13/10 10:32 PM.
Freedom is a fragile thing ...Those who have known freedom, and then lost it, have never known it again. -- Ronald Reagan
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Re: Poachers
[Re: FISHUNTER]
#1595600
08/13/10 10:33 PM
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 9,763
Tin Head
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 9,763 |
This story seems to have lost a lot of the info that was posted when It happened, from what I remember. The article seems to say the foreigner with no understanding of boundaries just opened up and kill them . I believe it turned out like below where the guys cornered the Asian guy and insulted him because of his race, then while walking away they took shots at the ground, then he gunned them down. Last year on my lease in Nacogdoches we saw a truck parked in front of our main gate at 1am. There were 5 of us there so we "loaded up" and jusmped in my truck and snuck up to him with the headlights off. We were pretty sure he had a buddy on our place hog hunting and was waiting on him to return to the gate. We have had problems with this in the past. The guy was obviously nervous and couln't get his story straight. We let him drive off without his buddy. When he drove off we unloaded about 50 rounds into the ground from various handguns,ak's,7mags etc.....At 1am it echoed for miles and sounded frightingly loud. Anybody poacher on our proerty at the time would have taken a dump where they stood. The gate was the only way out to the road. We have not seem them since. If a paocher is caught hold him at gun point if need be and call the GW , not your beer drinking buddies.
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Re: Poachers
[Re: FISHUNTER]
#1595918
08/14/10 01:36 AM
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Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 957
robbf213
Tracker
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Tracker
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 957 |
If I am confronted on my property by a poacher who is armed I can exercise my right to protect myself and shoot him. (from the words of the game warden) Don't do this. Unless you actually want a cellmate...
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Re: Poachers
[Re: robbf213]
#1596105
08/14/10 02:56 AM
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 4,394
Chuck McDonald
Extreme Tracker
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Extreme Tracker
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 4,394 |
How could they lock you up for that. The hunter approaches his stand and confrots the poacher. The hunter shoots him, killing him. Hunter calls the local law enforcement. Hunter tell locals that he approached the stand, told the guy to get off the property, the poacher raised his weapon aggressively so hunter shot him. Unless they can get the dead poacher to talk there isn't a DA in Texas who would prosecute this, well maybe around Austin.
Last edited by Chuck McDonald; 08/14/10 03:08 AM.
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Re: Poachers
[Re: txhunter24]
#1596110
08/14/10 02:59 AM
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Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 158
TAKE EM
Woodsman
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Woodsman
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 158 |
Had a place in Haskell that had two many access points we caught people on game cam , found shell casings, car tracks , found trash in our stands that was not there the weekend before it makes it very frustrating to put all the hard work into a place to have crap like this taking place while you aren't there . I also had a place in archer city that was on a deadend road we were the last place except for the land owners house had a wheatfield next to the road a spot lighters dream we had problems in the past with the issue . We had gone into town to eat and one the way back I noticed the tail lenses of a pickup that was parked down the hill pulled into our second gate i flew down the gravel road sliding in my truck right behind the outher vehicle as i noticed someone in the truck thinking they were waiting on ther friend to find the deer that they had shoot i ran up to the truck put a 45 up to the window to realize it was a 16year old boy getting his first bj i you should have seen the look on his face priceless i felt like crap knowing i ruined his night guarantee he wont ever forget that night .
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Re: Poachers
[Re: TAKE EM]
#1596177
08/14/10 03:34 AM
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 456
raiderJ
Bird Dog
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Bird Dog
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 456 |
Had a place in Haskell that had two many access points we caught people on game cam , found shell casings, car tracks , found trash in our stands that was not there the weekend before it makes it very frustrating to put all the hard work into a place to have crap like this taking place while you aren't there . I also had a place in archer city that was on a deadend road we were the last place except for the land owners house had a wheatfield next to the road a spot lighters dream we had problems in the past with the issue . We had gone into town to eat and one the way back I noticed the tail lenses of a pickup that was parked down the hill pulled into our second gate i flew down the gravel road sliding in my truck right behind the outher vehicle as i noticed someone in the truck thinking they were waiting on ther friend to find the deer that they had shoot i ran up to the truck put a 45 up to the window to realize it was a 16year old boy getting his first bj i you should have seen the look on his face priceless i felt like crap knowing i ruined his night guarantee he wont ever forget that night . Thats funny!!! You poached the smile off his face!
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Re: Poachers
[Re: raiderJ]
#1596207
08/14/10 03:49 AM
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 11,933
#Hayraker
Chihuahua
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Chihuahua
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 11,933 |
how did you know that it was his first?
#sigline
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Re: Poachers
[Re: TAKE EM]
#1596220
08/14/10 04:04 AM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,074
Justin T
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 6,074 |
Had a place in Haskell that had two many access points we caught people on game cam , found shell casings, car tracks , found trash in our stands that was not there the weekend before it makes it very frustrating to put all the hard work into a place to have crap like this taking place while you aren't there . I also had a place in archer city that was on a deadend road we were the last place except for the land owners house had a wheatfield next to the road a spot lighters dream we had problems in the past with the issue . We had gone into town to eat and one the way back I noticed the tail lenses of a pickup that was parked down the hill pulled into our second gate i flew down the gravel road sliding in my truck right behind the outher vehicle as i noticed someone in the truck thinking they were waiting on ther friend to find the deer that they had shoot i ran up to the truck put a 45 up to the window to realize it was a 16year old boy getting his first bj i you should have seen the look on his face priceless i felt like crap knowing i ruined his night guarantee he wont ever forget that night . LOL
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Re: Poachers
[Re: Chuck McDonald]
#1596282
08/14/10 04:50 AM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,732
TxTechsan
Extreme Tracker
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Extreme Tracker
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 3,732 |
How could they lock you up for that. The hunter approaches his stand and confrots the poacher. The hunter shoots him, killing him. Hunter calls the local law enforcement. Hunter tell locals that he approached the stand, told the guy to get off the property, the poacher raised his weapon aggressively so hunter shot him. Unless they can get the dead poacher to talk there isn't a DA in Texas who would prosecute this, well maybe around Austin. X2
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Re: Poachers
[Re: Txduckman]
#1596595
08/14/10 02:16 PM
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Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,044
Eland Slayer
THF Trophy Hunter
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THF Trophy Hunter
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 5,044 |
I can't go into too many details but found out buddies place was being poached by the ranch foreman. He lived there and knew when who was going to be there so wasn't too hard to get away with but after years of no big deer thye finally found out why. Kinda sucks when you put all that work into 11K acres and someone behind your back destroys it. And they guy is sitll there but on a very tight leash. He is a heck of a worker but in that part of Texas you are better off keeping your enemies close. lol. I don't doubt for a minute that they guy was poaching.....but there is no way one man was able to poach all the good deer off 11,000 acres by himself.....not without a helicopter and a mini-gun.
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Re: Poachers
[Re: MELackey]
#1596720
08/14/10 03:56 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 10,496
Halfadozen
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 10,496 |
Insurance is for accidents and acts of God not gross negligence and/or intent to harm. Right but these guys say they just want to throw boards with nails out b/c they want to. Insurance will pay up before wasting tens of thousands from court fees unless the person dies from tenanus. lol. Anyway, it's not a good idea unless you like attorney's. As an underwriter specializing in General liability insurance, I can say that We would fight pretty hard to deny the claim if it was an intentional / malicious act. Regarding the defense costs... Where there is no coverage, there is no duty to defend... You better believe my carriers would file for summary judgement and would get dismissed from the case PDQ. If I was you and thought I might "accidently" leave lumber laying around with nails in it, I dang sure wouldn't mention it online... We all know there are poachers who lurk around this site - and especially in the Photo forum - constantly asking where a buck got shot - trying to narrow down to a county road or landmark. Like "we hunt off FM 1745 near Dodge Cemetery". I wouldn't believe everything you read on here - alot of this dribble is half truths. Here is some stuff I found about trespassing and liability - looks like ME Lackey is correct - read on According to the Texas Penal Code, a “No Trespassing Sign” is automatically imparted by fences or other enclosures obviously designed to exclude intruders or to contain livestock. Judon Fambrough is an attorney and senior lecturer at the Real Estate Center of Texas A&M University. “According to case law, a landowner’s liability, or responsibility, for anyone entering the property depends on the legal classification of the person at the time of the injury,” he said. While state laws differ, most rely on these classifications: • Invitees, including fee-paying hunters. You must protect them by keeping your property safe and warning them of dangerous conditions that a reasonable inspection would reveal. • Licensees, including nonpaying hunters with permission. You have a duty to warn them of known dangerous conditions or make the place safe, but no inspection is required. • Trespassers, including hunters not given permission. You owe trespassers little legal duty. • Trespassing children unaccompanied by an adult. You have greater responsibility to children. Landowner’s Liability to Hunters A landowner’s liability (or responsibility) for the safety of anyone entering the property depends on the legal classification of the person at the time of injury. There are four categories: an invitee, a licensee, a trespasser and children under the attractive nuisance doctrine. Theoretically, a hunter could fit in any one of these. Fee-paying hunters are classified as invitees. Landowners have a legal duty to keep the premises safe for the invitee’s protection. The landowner must give the fee-paying hunter adequate and timely notice of concealed or latent perils (dangerous conditions) that are personally known or that a reasonable inspection would reveal. Injuries caused by dangerous conditions that are apparent or that could be revealed by reasonable inspection are the landowner’s responsibility, but comparative negligence may lessen the liability. (See reprint 893, "Landowner Liability for Hunters," for a complete explanation of comparative negligence.) Nonpaying hunters with permission to hunt are classified as licensees. Landowners have a legal duty to warn licensees of known dangerous conditions or to make the conditions reasonably safe. No inspection is required. Hunters who enter without permission are classified as trespassers. The landowner owes them no legal duty. The law prohibits the landowner from willfully or wantonly injuring a trespasser except in self-defense or when protecting property. The landowner is liable for gross negligence or for acts done with malicious intent or in bad faith.
Freedom is a fragile thing ...Those who have known freedom, and then lost it, have never known it again. -- Ronald Reagan
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Re: Poachers
[Re: Halfadozen]
#1596750
08/14/10 04:08 PM
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,415
Huntmaster
Veteran Tracker
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Veteran Tracker
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 2,415 |
Like I've posted before, all this Rambo stuff will end up with you in jail and broke. Confront the guy, tell him to stay off your property and call the game warden. And don't blow a hole through him with some jacked up, hand loaded, reload.
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Re: Poachers
[Re: Huntmaster]
#1596778
08/14/10 04:26 PM
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Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 10,496
Halfadozen
THF Celebrity
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THF Celebrity
Joined: Oct 2009
Posts: 10,496 |
Like I've posted before, all this Rambo stuff will end up with you in jail and broke. Confront the guy, tell him to stay off your property and call the game warden. And don't blow a hole through him with some jacked up, hand loaded, reload. Don't disagree with you
Freedom is a fragile thing ...Those who have known freedom, and then lost it, have never known it again. -- Ronald Reagan
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Re: Poachers
[Re: Huntmaster]
#1596779
08/14/10 04:26 PM
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,292
moderno
Extreme Tracker
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Extreme Tracker
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,292 |
I agree with you Huntmaster, some people just dont understand the legal ramifications of a situation like this. Especially those that dont own any land.
Bartender, bring me anything except brake fluid, cause I don't plan on stopping!
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Re: Poachers
[Re: Halfadozen]
#1597952
08/15/10 05:16 AM
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Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,615
MELackey
Pro Tracker
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Pro Tracker
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 1,615 |
So I guess an electric fence would fall under the same category? Even if it was posted. So if someone didn't have livestock but put up an electric fence anyway. That's an "intentional" act.
an electric fence would be something that is reasonable and customary on a tract of land that could be used to contain livestock. A booby trap is a different thing altogether. A person can generally tell when there is an electric fence, all you have to do is look for the insulator on every post...
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