Coyote poison?

Best-good-friend has lost 2 calves in the last 2 weeks to predators on a leased place . The land owners that live on the place see the dang coyotes almost daily and they harass their guineys, but don't shoot em WTF? Anyway we've hunted this place for years, and have taken countless coyotes and bobcats. Hunting is not keeping them in check, so we need something else that'll work. I believe coyotes won't go into a trap, none I've ever seen. This morning I heard the idea of setting snares in the tree lines where the cattle can't get to it. The noose type over bait.

Is there any poison that can be set out that the deer won't touch? This place is in Collin County, I've seen the deer, I saw two seperate rubs and scrapes 2 weeks ago, so I know the deer are there. We don't want to harm the deer because it's wrong and probably illegal. But we need to thin down the coyotes in the worst way.

Before anyone jumps in and says "hey I'll come hunt for ya", it's not gonna happen- landowner says so! Myself and my friend are the only hunters allowed on the place unsupervised.

What to do?

I am sure there is all kinds of chemicals that would work but I would be really careful. In fact I probably wouldn't do it. You can get in some serious trouble if you inadvertantly poison something else. Even buzzards dieing from eating poisoned coyotes.

If hunting isn't working maybe you could call a government trapper.

I think you have to have permits to use poison. Might want to Google the story about the Eastland county peanut farmers and their escapade of trying to poison hogs. They even have the federal LEO looking at them.

i have never done it because i was scared to harm another animal or my dogs but a friend once injected anti-freeze into hot dog weiners... before anyone jumps to conclusions I have never done this i have just heard of it and the buddy that was telling me i dont know if i believe that he did it but i know it would work because he tested it on a stray dog at his farm then discarded the animal to keep from scavengers getting sick/killed

Antifreeze will kill them all right, but it is a pretty agonizing death, and dogs can't resist lapping the stuff up. either. I'd suggest passing on the antifreeze solution.

x2 on the trapper

Does the trapper charge a fee?

A place I hunted on years ago had a gov'nt trapper, he used a cyanide "bomb", govenment stuff, civilians probably couldn't get them. BUT.... I have also seen him use a LARGE trebel hook tied with parachute cord about 3 ft off the ground baited with meat.

I always used snares on fence lines myself.

Dang Rick, that sounds like some crazy stuff right there. lol.

someone said get a trapper, and that is a really good idea! I know one of our local fur trappers, and he does not charge, but he wont come out there unless u really have a problem. He is darn good, and if he is going out for a yote, he catches a yote, if he is going for a coon, he catches a coon. wish i was that good.

as far as poison, not sure if they are still allowed to use em, but the M 44 trap that hits yotes with cyanide, they did that out on our place many years ago and took out a whole bunch of yotes!

Yea... M44 traps... I'm not afraid of many things but I always walked a wide circle around those things, they just sounded like they'd git cha!

Plus I was 30 yrs younger and had a bigger imagination.

I think I'll go with the snares first. I can get some 1/8" cable at Gebo's in McKinney pretty cheap. And I've got some old meat in the freezer that needs to go anyway. I just hate for any animal to suffer, so I'll have to check the snares pretty often.

Well I was a Texas Gov trapper and the M44's you guys are speaking of do work and our still used today but the Gov has strict rules about wear they put them as well as they must have a special applicator's license to even get a hold of them and they are not a trap they are a mechanical devices that once baited shoots a chemical into the coyotes mouth which kills it on contact with any saliva or moisture it touches it can be deadly if your not trained how to use it properly.The foot traps will work better than snares and can target certain animals instead of any old creature walking into a snare and getting hung pretty much. I would get someone experienced in trapping and let them take a look before you educate the target coyotes and then make things harder for the next guy who deals with stuff like this all the time I would help you but its pretty far from wear I live and you need to check your traps daily to stay on top of things I hope this helps. Skinner

SKINNER PREDATOR HUNTER, thanks for the sharing of wisdom. What would be a good source for the foot traps? I know Valley Mills I went right through there on Tuesday on our way to I35 from Gatesville. I got a speeding ticket there 3 years ago. Yes it's a pretty far piece from where our problem is, thanks again.

M44's are super dangerous and like Skinner said, only certain people can buy them now. The guy behind us uses a trapper and he still uses the m44's
snares are good ,but steel traps are better for yotes, and if ya can find a "bitch" yote pup(dont know if a bitch dog will work, but definantly know that a yote will), cage her and on the botton of the cage, ya need rabbit wire for the floor. Place a drain pan under the cage. Collect the female urine and use for the steel traps. you will catch most of the Alpha males,and or the males looking for a pack this way, reducing the population tremendously

I've got a female Blue Heeler. She wouldn't appreciate me caging her up though. I bet a female dog would work, I've heard of Coyotes coming in to investigate a female dog before. I don't know if they were wanting to fight or breed though.

get a Donkey or 2

The donkeys do work, we moved one out there years ago and he was more trouble than he was worth at the time. Might be time to rethink that.

I'm not mean enough....

My uncle has M44 out on his ranch. I don't know how he got them or where but he does have big $$ and connections. I can attest to how well those work, he has a fence that the ranch hand hangs all of the dead coyotes on that he finds next to the traps and there are always at least 15 of them hanging up and often a new one every other day. They are kinda scary, but everyone he has out on the ranch is clearly marked by multiple warning signs on trees and fence posts near them. If you can get them then you really should try them cause they work.

We have a coyote problem too and it will take more than shooting the occasional one from the deer stand to thin them.

I've considered going to one of the predator hunting forums and finding someone who would help us out. You say it's not an option for you but some of the predator guides might make it worth the land owners while.

Dang, wish some of the coyote problems were closer to me...I'm licensed for M-44s and was a gov't trapper back in the 80's.

Fur trapping is one thing, predator/depredation control is a whole different story...you are usually after predators that have turned to killing domestics or agriculture crops (coyotes will do a number on watermelon fields). Knowing 'how' to set foot-hold traps for them and not wise them up is the main key as well as scent control, set location and also gang-setting.

PM sent

lmao, learn something new every day!

1/8 in cable is too big for coyote. it doesn't tighten as well on them as smaller ones and it's easier to see. try 3/32, i think your money will be better spent. steel traps can be had fairly cheap on ebay, or you can order from the company. Duke, victor, montgomery, sleepy creek, and blake and lamb all still make traps. duke are the cheapest, but they are not made quite as well as the others, a big yote can tear one up, especially if it is not quite big enough. look up how to make a dirt hole set, it's a lot of trappers' bread and butter set and it's not that diffcult. you're gonna have to boil your traps and handle them with gloves, if a coyote smells the trap he's either gonna dig it up or roll on it, neither will get him caught. good luck.

Hi Guys. I'm new here. We have a BIG coyote problem here in Indiana. We're in deep ravined forest lands, with flat farm fields on high ground. Lots of feed for coyotes. Here , if you search the ravines you can usually find their den dug in under some tree roots. I have some extensive expierence from the wine industry in that CO2 from fermenting wine can kill a person in about 6 breaths. by the time you realize that your dizzy, it's too late to do anything but fall thur the door.
My, as yet untried solution, is to carry a small bottle of CO2 from a welding supply store to the den, run a hose in, and shovel dirt over all openings. I would estimate that 60 secounds of CO2 from the high pressure bottle should flood any den area.

X2!!!!

if youre going for the do it yourself trapping and snaring you might want to look at the arcives on trapperman.com. Trapping can also be pretty addicting. I trap quite a bit myself.

Snares hanging from the bottom strand of a fence work great. Bait it and make sure that the fence is low enough that a deer wont go under it. Foot hold traps are great too. I've only used them once, but we killed a hog and wired the carcass to a tree as bait. Set out 5 traps around the carcass and had 2 coyotes in the traps the next morning and caught another one later that afternoon.

Your solution should work great. When we trapped, we were provided smoke bombs.

But the only solution is persistent predator control. At the least, practice intensive methods from November thru April.

Contained below is info explaining why. I wrote this for a different forum and just copied it for you.






COYOTE FACTS

To every fact about a coyote, there is an exception. These facts are for the other 99%.


"DID YOU KNOW:


-Depending on the coyote density, a pair will set up a permanent territory of 10 square miles or more
-Coyotes only breed once each year
-Even the males are infertile most of the rest of the year
-Average litters during average years: West Texas is 4; Central Texas is 6. Almost all pups make it to 1 year
-Coyotes live in pairs (one male and one female) rather than packs. They do not look for a leader as do dogs and wolves
-Females will have large litters during good conditions, small litters in poor conditions, and will reabsorb fetus when conditions are very bad.
-Although the coyote will mate (rarely) with dogs and wolves, the genetics are so strong, within a few generations the coyote traits dominate.
-A pair of coyotes (a small percentage) can learn to hunt together so well, that they can bring down grown deer and small to medium size cattle.
-The main threat to cattle is seizing the newborn calf. When this happens, there is seldom any evidence left. In the panhandle, an intensive coyote control was conducted with ranchers reporting a 15% increase in the calf crop in the months following.
-When the population of coyotes is high and the deer herd is low, the coyotes will kill all or almost all of the fawns. So, seeing how many fawns live for a few months is a good indicator of damage caused by coyotes.
-Coyotes are commonly mistaken for wolves. Remember a wolf is taller than a German shepherd and has a footprint the size of a ladies hand.
-With a winter coat, the coyote can look very large, but less than 1% in central and west Texas will weigh 40 lbs or more.
-When coyotes have been captured ---- tagged ------ and then recaptured (a year or more later), the average distance that the recaptured coyotes traveled from their initial capture point was 26 miles. This implies that a yearling coyote might and probably does travel an average of 26 miles to establish a new territory. Keeping this in mind then, if each year all coyotes were removed in a circle with a radius of 26 miles (52 miles in diameter), the following year new coyotes would reinhabit the unclaimed area. That area would be 2100 square miles..


COYOTE YEARLY CYCLE:
---------The dates below are target dates. 90% of the activity below happens within 2 weeks of the target dates.

-------- TARGET DATES ---------------

FEBRUARY 15; The pair breeds
APRIL 15; The pups are born. The mom has already dug a den in soft ground. The pups will stay underground for a few weeks. The adults restrict their movement until the following late fall.
JULY 15; The pups find their voice and get real noisy for a while. The parents will scold them and by August, most of the howling is stopped
AUGUST 15; The pups begin traveling and learning from the parents.
DECEMBER 15; The yearling female travels to find and set up a new territory of her own.
JANUARY 15; The yearling male finds the female.

And then the cycle repeats. Each year, the pair may have one or two yearling (holdover pups) stay with them.

During Nov 1 through March 1, there is tremendous movement of young coyotes searching for a territory of their own and also the older ones marking and protecting their territory.

If a "pack" is simply a group of coyotes, then there are sometimes a "pack" of coyotes, but, if the definition of "pack" is meant to be the same as a "pack of wolves", then the word is misused for coyotes. There is a very distinct difference in the biology of the coyote and the wolf.

A wolf pack has a dominant male (alpha) and female that the other pack members follow (somewhat similar to us). In the absence of other wolves, we become the alpha wolf to a pet wolf. Wolves are predictable in their travel habits and are easier to catch. A sidenote, the greatest living wolf trapper remaining in the world lives near Abilene.

Coyotes on the other hand look up to no one but have an intimate relationship with their mate. Those who have tried to tame a coyote find total failure at about 2 years. All trappers will tell you that catching the last few coyotes in an area is the most difficult trapping in the world. No exaggeration.

A while back, a local goat rancher said "we never had any problems with coyotes back in the 40's and 50's". It caught me off guard. I had to think and then realized there was one major event: THE ERADICATION OF THE SCREWWORM. For those who don't know, the screwworm is the larvae (maggot) of a fly. The screwworm fly lays eggs on a wound and the larvae eat away at the flesh. Practically any wild animal scratched from spring through fall (prior to 1960 in Texas) would die.

Also, during the 60's compound 1080 poison was used extensively and eradicated the coyote through much of Texas. Compound 1080 is very "canine specific" meaning that a tiny amount will kill a coyote, but a relatively large amount will not bother a buzzard or skunk and other animals which are not canine. In 1972, compound 1080 was banned (for baiting carcasses). This allowed the coyote to quickly repopulate.

Another event: The fur market changed (most furs are shipped to Europe). About 20 years ago, the fur growers in Europe had a law passed preventing furs from being imported where the leghold trap was still legal for use (this targeted the US). The drop in fur prices took away much of the incentive for coyote hunting".




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traps and more traps also try a good 223 all work well

I cleaned it up some should have some room lol