Diane Finestein

Just stated, "all veterans are mentally ill and the government should over see that they should not be allowed to own guns". Come on aeb and dogcatcher and tell us what she really meant, since you guys are big fans of all things liberal.

When did she say this? Can you please provide an audio or video link please. I want to hear it.

As much as I detest Frankenstein, here's what was really said. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_1HtPMzAmv0

Yes, she said ptsd is an advent of the war in iraq and there is no way for a seller to know if the veteran is not affected in some way or another by this new advent there fore vets should not be able to purchase. So yes. Correct.

Thanks for the link. It appears she really is trying to cram her entire foot in her mouth. Her ideology is that if there are a few members that shouldn't be allowed to own a gun for mental health reasons, then nobody should be allowed to own a gun. That thought process is completely moronic. Why should the 99.5% of healthy soldiers not be allowed to own a weapon because of the .5% that shouldn't. Thanks Frankenstein.

After watching the clip, I don't think she was stating that all veterans are mentally ill. I think she was saying that because a few of them are, then none of them should be allowed to own an assault rifle. Let them eat cake!

Not a fan of Feinstein but she simply didn't say "all" veterans should be denied the right to buy assault weapons.

Don't put quotes around something that isn't a quote.

Nope....but I'll bet way down deep inside she'd like to have it that way!

Not so deep I'm afraid HnF.

.......agreed!

The only people most liberals think should be armed are the ones on their security detail....the rest of us just get to take our chances. I guess we're just not important enough to be worthy of government funded protection and just too stupid to protect ourselves. Wow...putting it that way it almost makes sense!

If you have been diagnosed with PTSD..you therefore are suffering from a mental disorder..and according to current gun sale restrictions should not be allowed to purchase a weapon. And I'm not a liberal...far from it. Maybe it will cut down the amount of VA compensation claims if they thought about it.

Here you go sensitive one. "If I could have gotten just 51 votes, I would have said to Mr. And Mrs. American, turn them all in, but I could not just get the votes". Feinstein. Democrats just can't stand that pesky 2nd ammendment, unless they are the ones using it.

I in no way disagree with that. I'm more pro 2A than most gun owners i know. I'm simply saying its bad practice to quote something that isnt a quote. its misleading. and our best chance to win this fight is with facts, not assumptions...

Frankenheifer strikes me as the most mentally unstable pos on the planet.

I don't know? toss up between her and N. Pelosi

First they came for the Iraq veterans and I said nothing. I see a Vietnam service ribbon on your sig. Did you ever use your weapon on another human being? Many said yours too was an immoral and unjust war. How could you use a weapon on a fellow human in an unjust fashion? They say once you use a weapon on another human the second time is easier. How do we know you can be trusted with your Constitutional rights?
How many patriots had nightmares in 1779 about the battles they fought? Maybe they should have all had tbeir homes searched and rifles confiscated for their efforts! In the Civil War it was called Soldiers heart, should they all have been disarmed?. In WW 1 it was called shell shock. WW 2 battle fatigue.

Maybe you need to be monitored? Maybe you should be judged without violating a law? How can we trust you with a gun? Yes, give them an inch as they will stop there, if you think about .

Audie Murphy the most decorated soldier in our nation fought in WW 2 suffered from what they called then battle fatigue, now PTSD. His kids all said he did. He struggled to maintain marriages. His friend who owned a gym in LA said he would call every now and then and talk about killing himself. It has been said by many he carried a .45 every where he went. He also drank too much. Maybe Feinstein would bave enjoyed seeing him stripped of his Constitutional rights.
just because a bunch of left wing nutters like Sandy Hook (a homosexual pedophile)and Colorado (campaigned for bo) go on mass shooting does not mean the first target should be our Vets.

[quote}I see a Vietnam service ribbon on your sig. Did you ever use your weapon on another human being? [/quote]

I may be mistaken, but I think I see a Purple Heart with OLC in BB's sig. My eyes are tired, but unless I'm wrong, please don't preach to that man.

I wouldn't piss in her ear if her brain was on fire, but she definitely did not say what is quoted in the OP. She is, however, trying to exclude all military veterans from owning what she calls assault rifles based on the fact some of them suffer from PTSD. I found it interesting that she said PTSD is a new phenomenon since the war in Iraq when anyone with half a brain knows it has been around as long as war itself. Someone could fill a full time position doing nothing but correcting things she screws up.

It would be a good thing in your eyes if Veterans suffering from PTSD did NOT seek any help because they would be afraid they would lose their right to own a weapon?

I really hope that I am misunderstanding what you were trying to say.

I would hope that those that can live a relatively normal life and are not considered a danger to themselves or others would consider not filing for PTSD. But whether they do or not it would be good for them to know that if they buy a gun they are commiting a felony. The VA apparently weeds out a lot of those cases because only 40% of PTSD filing are approved. Those that cannot live a normal life or are a danger to themselves or others should not be allowed to purchase or carry guns.

Yes I have used a weapon on another human being...200 times. And it does get easier with every trigger pull. Really didn't care whether it was an unjust or immoral war...I was a warrant officer making sure I got home as well as the troops I was supporting. From your descriptions of what you think PTSD is you might want to look up some defintions. BTW you are exhibiting signs of PTSD...might have that checked out.

Yep it's a good thing this crazy old vet has no guns. When will they come for my cast iron skillets?

I still can't figure out why we citizens are deemed smart enough to vote and serve on juries but not smart enough to own firearms.

I may be mistaken, but I think I see a Purple Heart with OLC in BB's sig. My eyes are tired, but unless I'm wrong, please don't preach to that man.[/quote]

And? By your standards he should not preach to me.

Yes I have used a weapon on another human being...200 times. And it does get easier with every trigger pull. Really didn't care whether it was an unjust or immoral war...I was a warrant officer making sure I got home as well as the troops I was supporting. From your descriptions of what you think PTSD is you might want to look up some defintions. BTW you are exhibiting signs of PTSD...might have that


lol, I need to be checked out? You fired on 200 people with never losing a wink of sleep and the compassion of Dexter and I need to be checked out? At what point did you lose all your humanity? See how it can be twisted by anyone with and agenda? I will have her add Viet Vets with no problems with killin people to the list.

Nobody comes back like they left who saw much combat, it's just a matter to what degree and in which fashion that change manifest its self. Some have better coping skills than others.

We give countries that hate us billions of dollars every year and you get all huffy about some vets that get a few hundred bucks a month. Yes, VA compensation is our financial problems as a nation.

Since you missed all the points, Feinsteins point was saying that PTSD is a creation of the
Iraq war(to my point obviously not true), and since you can't tell who has it and who does not that all should be banned. Maybe should send her an email about Vietnam vets who have no feelings at all about the ones they killed? Get it?

Much like with every war the previous generation thinks their war was better and they handled it better. But unlike any war in the past it is this generaration who their government wishes to deem them as undesireable and not fit to reap the benefits of the Constitution to which they swore a blood oath and upheld in the same fashion. Why? Because of the Liberal anti gun agenda, not because of some false sense of security they claim every measure they push produces.

Ha Ha got your PTSD flowing? You're right I have excellent coping skills and I was good at my job of killing enemy soldiers..but I've never filed for PTSD. You're wrong on knowing who has it....if you have filed with the VA for PTSD and have received compensation you have been adjudicated. If you then try to buy a firearm you are commiting a felony....what's so hard to understand about that? Maybe you're a potential felon...huh?

Ha, hardly Dexter. Just because I dont feel the need to put my 201 file on my sig line so I can recall how much I enjoyed flying above the war shooting women working a water buff in a rice paddy (enemy supplies and such) and chalking it up to such a lofty confirmed kill count 200, while denegrating the Infantry Vets that had the gall to go to he VA and get "adjudicated" as you say does not mean I am a mental felon.

I was a NCO who still answers the phone from time to time and listens to my joes talk through some of the joys of war on he ground at 2' oclck in the a.m. , because they can't sleep. Some of which have been adjudicated by a VA system that beats them over the head everytime they went in to get treated for other injuries about them possibly having PTSD and that they can file a claim for it, while leaving out the fact they would lose their rights for doing so.

I dont think think they should never be allowed to shoot a turkey or a dove again for a rating. You are way to proud of killing some poor farmers in a mud pit. Judging by your wings you did it without getting blood on your hands and having to listen to them scream. But hey, shooting at bushes from 1000 ft up at 100 mph is fun.

One of the signature wounds due to better armor is TBI. Like 5 guys sitting in a vehilce with 150 lbs of tnt going off under it and them all getting knocked out, several times. Yet they all walk away or at least survive, unlike in previous conflicts. Those symptoms are the same as what the NFL players experience due to concussions. The symptoms mirror PTSD in almost everyway. Yet no one is talking about NFL players losing their rights.

You are the first "NCO" that I have met that has not appreciated air support...which leads me to believe you were probably some rear echelon supply or mess NCO....and is probably why you don't have a sig line with your 201. Pay attention sarge..... the law does not preclude most PTSD claimants from buying a firearm and Feinstein had nothing to do with the law as you see it on a gun purchase app. Nor does it preclude a vet diagnosed or not from hunting dove or turkey as you seem to think. Here is what it asks you “f. Have you ever been adjudicated mentally defective (which includes a determination by a court, board, commission, or other lawful authority that you are a danger to yourself or to other or are incompetent to manage your own affairs) or have you ever been committed to a mental institution?” If you say "yes" you will not be allowed to purchase a weapon. If you say "no" and are not sure how the VA has worded your mental condition you could be committing a felony. Now if you can't live with that quit wasting your time keystroking senseless internet BS and take an active role in changing the law.

Look who's PTSD is boiling to the top now. Oh, I appreciate air support Mr. BB. I was the guy on the ground controlling it and the artillery. The point of the entire thing was that she was saying All vets should be denied because you can't tell who has and who does not. Then you chimed in with your, maybe it will cut down on guys filing a claim, as if you thought she was right on target and what a great idea it was. I don't put my medals on a Sig line because medals don't impress me. I know guys who got them and did not deserve them and guys that did who did not and that lessens the appreciation for my own.

Huh? We have been deemed smart enough to own firearms. Says so right there in the constitution.

The Constitution says whatever the supreme court says it does. The 2nd ammendment seems to go before the court on a regular basis. The last vote went 5 to 4 over the wording just 3 yrs ago or so.
The libs say since private citizens are not in a "well regulaged militia" it's null and void. Put 1 or 2 more Sotomayors' on the bench and suddenly it no longer says what it says after some legaleese spin.

yes, it is that fragile. Which is why Democrats on a hunting forum crack me up.

You think that is funny? Ha Ha some big F'ng joke right? Real hilarious to make fun of kids going overseas and coming back all messed up right?

Shut your mouth, I don't care what you have in your signature. You think that buys you the right to talk down on this generation of warriors? IT DOESN'T.

Go ahead and make another PTSD joke towards me and show your true colors. I don't have PTSD, i'm just a NCO that is disgusted by the words of someone many would consider a hero.

Whoa....calm down big boy...there has been no fun poked at anyone coming back from overseas. You might want to read the threads before you loose your cool. My comment was directed at one individual... TF Panther who was ranting on about VN being an unjust, immoral war and me doing my job there..all the time thinking I was on Feinsteins side.....Chillllllllllllll

sigh, reading comprehension is not your strong suit. The point was and is, that by Feinsteins definition you should not be trusted with your Constitutional rights. The comment that you latched on too and failed to comprehend was the college protestors who denounced your war as immoral and unjust are todays liberal politicians who are pushing the gun control today and deeming the Iraq war as immoral and unjust and that we are all damaged goods. YOU chimed in and thought Feinstein was on target as it might cut down on VA claims. Do you get it now.?

Again, she is saying in a nut shell that ALL Iraq vets should have their rights revoked. I was making the parallel to your war since you said, it might cut down on VA claims which is not what her point was. I was also pointing out that you are not the same person before you went, which you know is true, but you claim you are. No person who has spent time in combat is considered " normal " by civillian stands and liberals know it and it scares them to death. Example, a liberal professor get robbed he would give them everything he has a grovel. A combat vet gets robbed and he might try to cut your head off with a pocket knife, which is an option as foreign as mars too them, therefore abnormal.
You did choose to demonize guys who have filed a claim with the VA, so Texas heat has a point.

Where did I chime in saying Feinstein was on target? I didn't! So your comprehension is lacking. Never even read your Feinstein article. The second amendment allows for you to "keep and bear arms" and does not apply to purchasing them. The discussion I was commenting on was PTSD and buying firearms. The comment made about cutting down VA claims was directed towards buying a gun with existing Brady law restrictions and if a vet felt that his PTSD was not severe enough then why risk losing his ability to buy a gun or the right to carry. When you apply for a PTSD disability you are not told of the reprecussions of you winning...one of which is not being allowed to purchase a firearm. Like I told you before I could care less if you or anyone else thinks the VN or any other war was just or immoral. The sacrifices made by vets past present and future give you those rights....but expect to get flamed if you misquote or misuse them.

If you think I'm going to take you "nutshell" synopsis of anything you are You haven't even followed your own post.

Holy cheese and crackers on the immoral aspect again. Dont read part of my post then comment. AGAIN, I was drawing a parallel between your war and mine. No woder you don't know what the thread is about, YOU did'nt watch it before commmenting!!!!!!! Also how would you like it if some B 52 pilot based out of the Phillipines was talking to a medevac pilot based out of Da Nang claiming he had 500 kills around Khe Sahn and feels perfectly fine, and the medevac pilot who flew his missions in ankle deep blood wanted to keep his constitutional rights he better not go to the VA seeking help besides there are too many claims any way and that might cut them down. Thats how I fell about what you said.

I have tried to put this in a manner that you could relate too. Unfortunately you are the type of person who comments without reading entire post or even watches the video which is what the thread is about and then you can't figure out why people were offended by your comments, then you have the audacity to call me crazy.

What on earth are you talking about?
You stated "she said ptsd is an advent of the war in iraq and there is no way for a seller to know if the veteran is not affected in some way or another by this new advent there fore vets should not be able to purchase". I stated "If you have been diagnosed with PTSD..you therefore are suffering from a mental disorder..and according to current gun sale restrictions should not be allowed to purchase a weapon. And I'm not a liberal...far from it. Maybe it will cut down the amount of VA compensation claims if they thought about it."
What I said is on topic...I did NOT say all vets should forfeit the rights to purchase firearms NOR did I say vets should not file for PTSD.
You're beginning to sound like a right wing Feinstein.

The only thing better then pumping up enemy body count is pumping up post count.

Hey Chief. Why don't you watch the video before you chime back in so you can be on the same page as everyone else. Let's start there.

Not about to give her a second on my time. I'm sorry I thought this thread was pertaining to taking away firearm purchases from returning combat vets, PTSD and its diagnosis.

You really think you can be not eligible to purchase and still be able to posses? You can't. Which is why I am against Veterans being made the battleground on the mental health issue and forfeiting the very rights they have helped preserve and losing their ability to hunt or protect their homes, without ever being convicted of a crime.

It also dismays me that vets are the target, yet you can be a registered Communist who wears I hate America T Shirts and calls America and evil country or be a member of the Muslim Brotherhood living in the US giving speeches on evil America and be afforded all the rights the vet gave them while stripping him of his because he sought treatment for something that has been a by product of war since it's conception.
maybe I would have less of a problem with it if it was not given to us by people who have been attacking the 2nd Ammendment for 40 years. I am sure their intensions are sincere, hardly.

In the state of Tx a court order or an involuntary commitment to a mental health facility is required for it to be illegal for you to possess a weapon. To purchase you must NOT have been adjucated by a government agency as being a danger to yourself or others ot cannot manage your life without help. Problem is...you are totally unaware how the VA has rated you. The law really gets restrictive for you to carry or get a CHL.
And btw Feinstein has had nothing to due with the legislation Bill Clinton got passed or was passed by the Brady bill or Tx state statutes...her crap is still down the road.

Actually, you will know how the VA rated you. They are required to provide due process rights saying a mental health specialist has found you incapable of managing your affairs. You have 60 days to request a personal hearing and present evidence that you are not incompetent. A field examination may be conducted at your residence. Only after the 60 days has expired can the final determination of incompetency be made. Some Veterans (no offense to anyone intended) file a claim, go to their exam, and exaggerate their symptoms to get a higher evaluation. The problem is, by exaggerating their symptoms to such severity they run the risk of being found incompetent by the VA because the doc said so.

That's good to know. I personally would fight with the devil to keep weapons away from dangerous people whether they be military vets, or civilians and anyone who wouldn't is not helping the second amendment cause..just a few more Kris Kyles, Chad Littlefields or Virginia techs will give the Feinsteins of this country all they need.

What's really scary is that, unless you have a wife, they withhold benefit payment, including back-pay, until they appoint a fiduciary. If you have a wife they don't. She gets the money.

edited to add: That was meant to be at least a bit humorous. (fail) They do conduct regular inspections and account audits to be sure the benefit payments are being used appropriately for the care of the Veteran.

I was going to let this lie but feel strong enough about the subject that I decided not. TF Panther...while your heart may be in the right place your mouth and mind aren't. First off you open a post about the subject ...then don't post the link to the article...then gripe later on because someone didn't view the video.
You begin misquoting Feinstein and was called on it.
You have no knowledge of existing gun laws or what legislation is coming down the road.
Then you "try" to attack the comments I made by coming up with senseless scenarios of killing women and shooting people in rice paddies, B52 pilots talking to medivac and about VN being a immoral and unjust war.
You have senselessly rambled on since you started this thread.
Yea you have a right to discuss anything you want but please stick to things you have knowledge for your own sake. Thank God we have competent representation with Vet organizations, NRA etc and not the likes of you.

Ok, I won't let it go either. Since much has been said much must be answered. I did not post a link because I was on a tablet, and dont have the know how to post a link on it yet. Had anyone done a search with that qoute, numerous links would have instantly popped up. Whoa, high crime there.. You commenting without watching the video is on you. What she said was all vets should be denied because you can't tell who has it or who does not. So all vets should be treated as if they have it, as in "all vets have ptsd", the title. Glad to know you have no qualms about it as it might cut down on claims which was not her point. The qoute I posted was actually the title to the video, but while not using the exact words in that exact order her point was exactly the same thing.
Since you posted without watching it, which someone else quickly added the link, my comments ( immoral and unjust war) were to get you to open your eyes and see that you are included in that group, because that is how the anti gun establishment views you, Claim or no claim. I have explained this too you several times. I was also pointing out that because you had no problem killing as you said, that maybe you are more of a threat than a guy who sought help at the VA? After all what type of person has no feelings about that? One might say a sociopath, I bet Feinstein would think so, because that is her point, which you fail to grasp because you never watched it before commenting on it.

Our society as a whole has recently decided to trade in its sensibilities in the name of safety. There is an 18 yo named Justin Carter who made a sarcastic threat while playing an online video game in San Antonio as teens will do, with no record and no history.. He now faces 10 years in prison because another kid reported it after egging him on and had his bail set at 500k and had the pleasure of being sexually assaulted in jail for being a 18 yo smart alec. All the while claiming it was just a bad joke and bewildered as to how this is happening. Sorry still cant post a link try google. All in the name of "safety".

You also assume that I have a claim for it because I empathize with guys who do because I know what it was like to come home and feel like you don't belong amoung the civilized folks for a while, which is also her point, which alarmed me to no end.

It is not about safety it is about picking one group off at a time, starting with vets because we are an easy target and because they are not losing many votes because the majority vote Rep, you know the god, guns, and country rift raft. This is the first time in our nations history of Veterans which we are being eyed as a danger. Yes, all of us. Which is why the dhs, released a memo to law enforcement citing that they should be wary of returning veterans as they maybe involved in right wing extremism you know like the Tea party or some other crazy group who supports the Constitution, that Dems have labeled as terrorist groups and a threat to America ( sorry cant post a link try google).

If a guy is sayjng his dog is talking to him telling him to do bad things or some such then he needs to be commited (i am all for that) and taken before a judge for a proper judgement. Not given final judgement by diagnoses from a VA doc who might have their own agenda which is what is happening now on a national level to the tune of 129,000 and counting. There are many vets who are counter suing on the matter now because they disagee with the VA's findings but had no way to argue their side. VA said so, so it is final. Slippery slope.

So what she was saying was that you, me and the guys that got a letter are all one in the same. If we don't stick together they will get to us all sooner or later. Her intensions were clear which you would have known had you watched the video, think big picture, not what the law is this second which can be changed with the stroke of the pen which we are seeing currently.

now go back to being hung up on immoral and unjust again.

5 yo kids are being kicked out of school for making hand gestures of a gun on the play ground all over the country. Another chewed a pop tart into the shape of a gun and was kicked out, all in the name of public safety.
I had to talk with my own 4 yo because his preschool was concerned, over his love for star wars (he wants to be luke skywalker....or a fireman) and him "pew, pewing bad guys (the empire) on the play ground. "Safety" is being used as a weapon, so forgive me for being leary when someone like Feinstein starts talking about keeping us safe from us vets claim or no claim, oh and 4 yo star wars fans.

pulled out lap top. Here is a link with links. http://www.storyleak.com/obama-executive-fiat-backdoor-gun-confiscation/