Somers (NY) PD officer caught on game camera stealing pro 2A sign

Saw this here:

http://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/2013/09...epeal-safe-act/


Pics here:

http://m.imgur.com/a/fNOBV


Original forum post happening in real time here (TONS of pages... All very entertaining, but the revelation made on 11th post of this page):

http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/laws-po...html#post607020




I'm very interested to see how this all turns out. If you've got the time to waste, the thread is entertaining to say the least.

Wow, things move fast. Got posted on theblaze last night:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/09/...-blew-him-away/

Looks like that cop is in trouble!

Possibly. But I am more interested in finding out if this was simply an officer following orders. That seems more likely than a rogue cop acting independently. It would be nice if the sign owner could file a complaint with the state police and have actual charges brought against the officer. I bet he'd be quick to admit if it was simply an order he was following.

Either way, it's some BS. Glad he got caught.

He dang sure can! File on the officer with the county or FBI. Everyone has a boss and for a dumbarse thing like this he needs to be fired and take his lumps. Pisses me off when stupid arse cops do stupid stuff that make honest guys and gals look like crap. Yup he needs to be fired, filed on and put in ever frickin paper in the land so his DA never gets another LE job. Just my take.

Bust him.

The guy who had his sign stolen has now been interviewed by the local news there, by Fox news on the phone, and has a multitude of interview requests. He has an attorney, and they are apparently filing a civil rights suit in federal court.

Lots of people fired up about this.

They may have an ordinance against signs and such, but either way the officer handled this poorly! I'd say fire him, but he looks ready for retirement anyway and as we have learned with Lois Learner, their actions doesn't cause them to lose their retirement benefits.

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/09/...eally-big-deal/

whats the big deal, the majority of the folks did not like the way he was expressing his 1st amendment right so the township sent their enforcement to handle the issue. yall are a bunch of cop haters...

Just from looking at their city code I doubt the sign was legal. Our code enforcemt folks confiscate tens of thousands of them a year.

Sure looks like the sign was in the right of way to me. It's illegal to put one there here in Texas. Read the fine print on all those election signs. I know a garage sale sign won't last an hour in my neighborhood.

I think I saw something about a FBI sign unit on CSI though....call em.

Pretty standard garbage for this section of the THF. City code violation and a confiscated sign. Some rag of a media source makes it out to be somthing it's not. The tin foil hat crowd runs around screaming the sky is falling, the sky is falling.

I knew that was you ntxtrapper, how was your trip to NY?

Nope I would be posting the 2nd amendment sign. The difference is, I am smart enough to know what size of sign is legal, where I can have it and not be trashy enough to put in my yard.

Pretty standard garbage from ntxtrapper. You have no facts about the specifics of this case, as they haven't been presented. But that doesn't stop you from instinctively jumping to the defense of a fellow officer.

And I already know you're ok with officers abusing the law and their position. You've made that astoundingly clear multiple times.

Regardless, I have a problem with the method used by this officer to remove the sign. Would it not be reasonable to simply talk to the homeowner?

I also have a problem with only specific signs being targeted. If a sign was targeted based upon the political message of the sign... I believe that's a violation of the sign owner's first amendment right, no? But I'm no lawyer. You're just a cop, so you don't make the law, you just enforce it. Except when you don't know it. Or when the law doesn't jive with your personal opinion. Or when you're having a bad day.

You appear to have the "I'm the LAW!" attitude. You don't appear to consider yourself a public servant; rather, you appear to believe you run the public. You appear to believe that you have a right to give fellow citizens orders. You, quite simply, give a bad name to the officers that actually have a desire to work with the community.

Personally, I have a duty to be a servant to everyone. Not because it's my career, but because it's my life choice. It must be a very conflicting existence to depend on fellow citizens to provide for your living expenses in exchange for your service to the public, while at the same time feeling superior to the public.

And the sky is falling. Ever hear of the SAFE act? The guy with the sign most definitely has.

Did we read the same story? You seem to have got more out of it than I did.

He always does......some kind of alien read between the lines thing......

I read the posts from before the story broke. I read about the man putting up a pro 2a sign, and having a neighbor be upset by it. Said neighbor called the city, and the man was contacted by the building inspector, who initially told him the sign was against code. The man spoke with the BI, who ended up telling the man that the sign was fine. No problem.

The man then had his sign go missing. He put up another, and it went missing as well. Believing it was his neighbor stealing his sign that was approved by the BI, he purchased and set up a game camera. He set it up improperly, and was unable to catch whoever took the sign the 3rd time. The 4th time, he got pics of an officer kicking the sign to break the post, then taking the sign.

Ntxtrapper then jumps on here, assumes the man to be some dumbass, and says he would have checked to make sure the sign was within code. If he would have read the posts rather than just spouting off, he would have known that the man discussed the sign with the BI, and got approval.

If ntxtrapper had said that the man was an idiot because the BI's approval meant nothing, I would have questioned why the city had the BI contact the man about the sign in the first place.

Anyhow, ntxtrapper automatically assumes whenever there is an issue between the police and a citizen, that the citizen is a dumbass, and the cop was right. Because it is very apparent that ntxtrapper believes the general population are dumbasses, he is superior, and the police are superior.

If you do not come to the same conclusion after reading ntxtrapper's posts on such matters, then we simply disagree.

Now, what exactly did I post that wasn't derived from information I've linked to? Other than ntxtrapper's past posts, as my opinion of him has nothing to do with this story.

Wow!!!! I'm trashy if I put a sign in my yard supporting the 2nd amendment. You my friend have issues! Glad your not enforcing the law in my city

A few more "rag(s) of a media source" have picked it up as well.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/09/25/hidden-camera-catches-culprit-taking-man-second-amendment-sign/

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/natio...elebre/2873727/

http://hudsonvalleyreporter.com/westches...ent-cries-foul/

Video interview.

http://video.foxnews.com/v/2698777971001...id=921261890001

The Police and how they do there job has changed a GREAT Deal in the last 50 years. They used to be people you could trust to do the right thing. But now you can not Trust them at All.

Now I am sure they are good officers still out there. But which ones. It is just not worth the risk.

I clearly saw the sign attack the officer first......LOL.

Funny chit Concho!!!

X2

The rest of the story.
http://somers.dailyvoice.com/news/supervisor-somers-police-justified-pro-gun-sign-removal

Quote:

The initial controversy stemmed from whether or not Gibson’s sign was on his own private property or town property. Somers police and the town’s highway department have officially determined it was indeed on town property, and therefore, not in violation of the Town of Somers code 170-125, which restricts the use of signs on public property. Under this code, the town is not required to officially cite a resident before taking action.

Rest of the story? You're funny. And a little bit lazy. All of the info you just posted has already been included in the multiple stories I linked to. Perhaps if you actually read the posts and links, you wouldn't be posting stuff that was already posted and addressed a week ago.

That's real adult of you, how old are you 12?

Are you kidding me? I have read your posts including blatantly false statements, emotional hyperbole, and, of course, underhanded comments questioning my intelligence, maturity, and value to society. I have seen DC post pictures implying people are "tin-foil hate wearers" and conspiracy theorists. Sometimes, y'all's posts are in reply to intelligent argument supported by facts and reason. That would be the definition of arguing like a child.

As for this particular post, DC decided to post the town's public response, which has been well documented in the links I provided. DC did not post intelligent argument regarding the content of the links, but instead regurgitated information that has already been addressed.

If one wanted to engage in respectful, intelligent conversation about the legality of a town picking and choosing which citizens it applies local laws to based upon the political views of the individual citizens by taking a view opposing mine, then sweet.

For example, one could say:

"I understand that the city building inspector approved of the sign location, but since it was not done in writing, I believe that the city was justified in removing a citizen's sign from their front lawn 4 times without notice. I also understand that there are documented pictures of numerous other local political and commercial signs in violation of the cited sign code, but still believe the city was justified. I know that the town's response to those other signs is that they do the best they can to remove all signs, but many get overlooked, and this guy's sign was never overlooked, to the point it was removed 4 separate times while other signs remained posted, but it had absolutely nothing to do with the content of the sign... And I still believe the city was justified.

I also understand that the land survey has not yet been completed, and that even if the sign was in the right if way, the property is still technically the owner's as he maintains and pays taxes on said property, the sign was not a permanent structure, and the town code itself will be challenged as unconstitutional in that it possibly infringes on this citizens 1st amendment rights, but I still believe the city is justified."

If someone posted that, we could discuss our views, even though they are complete polar opposites.

But if you post a link to a week-old news story which is simply a regurgitation of a portion of a link I already posted, and present it as factual support for your opposing view, I'm gonna call you out for it.

You call me names and insult my intelligence by asking me if I'm 12. I'm not the one calling people names or blindly arguing with someone without even bothering to read what I am arguing about.

How about this for the "rest of the story":

http://www.lohud.com/article/20130930/OPINION/309300072/Take-NY-gun-law-complaint-Albany

"Maybe he should visit the town cemetery and explain to the Newtown school administrator buried there what his feelings are."

That is from a letter written by a member of the Somers Planning Board (whatever that is) in regards to the sign in question. This isn't definitive proof of town bias against gun rights, but it certainly brings into question the reason the pro gun sign was removed. Are y'all sure the signs message had nothing to do with the removal?

my, my, my......a little emotional today aren't we? I don't have the time nor patience to read all the links you throw up in your tirades against local governments.....

I clearly saw the sign attack the officer, again just saying.......

Are they tirades against local governments?

Or cop bashing? Or trolling? Am I unintelligent? Inexperienced? Immature? You've accused me of all, yet never take the time to actually understand what I am saying.

Rather than discuss facts presented, you have a habit of taking an opposing position and trying to steamroll me with uninformed emotional responses. (Remember telling me cops should be allowed to arrest open carriers on trumped up charges in case they are serial killers? Still waiting for you to list just one open carry serial killer. Lol)

Then you resort to name calling and baseless accusations.

Emotional? Sho nuff.

Well, the sign was openly displaying a rifle, so maybe he was arresting it for disorderly conduct/resisting arrest/etc.

Lies will get you nowhere, I never said anything about arresting on trumped up charges and you know it......sorry I even communicate and try to have a little entertainment, you are way too high strung and serious for me, and probably for a forum.

Pot, meet kettle.

Of course you didn't say that. You just called me cop hater for hating cops that abuse their powers. So I in turn called you a supporter of abusive cops based upon you opposing my opposition to abusive cops. Crystal clear? Or a bunch of BS? Or is it ok when you do it, but BS when I do? I think it's BS all the way around.

I am also entertained, thank you very much! I thoroughly enjoy discussion and intelligent argument. When it degrades into me being insulted, I also enjoy throwing a lil back at you. But I'm sorry that you feel I'm too high strung and serious for you and the forum, and that you're no longer entertained.

Did you hear the one about the rest of the story?

How does someone as angry as you have an intelligent argument? I didn't defend any abusive police officer, in fact I said I would be the first to ask for their job, I simply asked you to give them a fair shake until all the facts are known.

From the outside looking in, I think he has had great points and counters.

You said yourself that you don't care to read the provided links, so how can you say that you want to wait till the facts are known when you don't care to read about the issue?

That is because you back his every play, don't buddy up with another member and then try and justify his garbage saying that you agree, that's like your momma taking up for you......you kids need to grow up and get some real life experience, then we can talk.

Unlike you internet rangers, I don't base my opinion on newspaper article or Youtube.......why not get the true story? You certainly won't get the real story from the media.

two kids in the schoolyard agreeing, great......means tons to me.......

I guess that makes you ntxtrapper butt buddies huh, sorry if we both see the issue the same way, I tried to give you an honest opinion, but you can't even see it, that's fine IDGAF either way, and please explain to me how YOU are going to get the "true" facts, you must have some connections, please inform me chief.

Oh yes, you are way too mature, get the sand out of your vag and play ball, or go home.

You have yet to post any useful information on this post, please get your facts and let me see them, hell I might even change my mind, but it seems that you don't have any.

How does someone as obtuse as yourself have the ability to make an objective observation of my emotional state?

When have you been witness to me not giving an officer a fair shake? If you link me to my statement that was unfairly biased against a police officer, I will address and apologize for it. I try not to jump to conclusions without knowing facts.

You most definitely did defend/support officers charging open carriers with disorderly conduct/resisting arrest/BS charges. When you post things like "mess with the bull, you get the horns" or "play stupid games, get stupid prizes", and/or insult the arrestee, all while never stating that an officer making up BS charges to arrest someone is absolutely wrong, and also explaining that what the officer is doing is absolutely within the limits of his power, and that cops just enforce the law, that person will go before a judge/jury, blah blah blah... That is all supporting/defending officers abusing their powers.

Maybe we should make our definitions clear:
When an officer uses his powers to arrest someone for a BS charge, including, but not limited to disturbing the peace, resisting arrest, etc. because the person was open carrying and decided to be a complete prick to the cop, I consider that abuse. Do you?

It doesn't mean I don't feel for the cop, or that I like that the douchebag is being an ahole to the cop, or that I hate cops... It means I expect the police to have a little more self control than to let some ahole push them to abusing their power as a police officer. And if they can't handle some douchebag with a rifle acting like a douchebag, then they shouldn't be allowed to be an officer with arresting powers.

At least ntxtrapper is straight up. He pretty much posts that police should be able to punish douchebags for being douchebags and has no problem saying so. Which kinda makes me find of him. I can respect a guy that gives not an eff what anyone thinks.

I don't know that dude, and have no clue what play you speak of backing. I stand completely on my own.

On top of that, read his statement. What about that upsets you so much? This little tirade began when you jumped in defending DC, not by making an intelligent statement, but by calling me names. Am I taking crazy pills or are you just messing with me? Every accusation you make applies directly to you, and is included in the thread. So confused.

There are professionals that can help you with that.......

Concho. Let me make this clear to you: I AM NOT AN EFFING MORON. I take all news with a grain of salt. It is next to impossible to know actual facts in a story from media. Media will focus on facts that support whichever view they wish to push. The information I have gathered came from another forum, just like ours. NYfirearms.com. I read like 80 pages of 2 threads on that forum, the majority of them from before the story broke. It is an interesting read. That guy was NOT looking for Internet fame, or this crazy hassle. He simply wanted to support the 2nd amendment and repealing of the SAFE act by placing a sign. Then he wanted to catch his neighbor stealing his sign, which he belie...

What's the point. It's already been posted. By me. You openly admitted that you didn't even read my post, but you disagree with me, and that I'm a stupid kid.

Ok, fair enough......but some of you guys wage full scale war on local governments, who have no political agenda.....most of those folks running cities have real jobs during the day and only try to make their communities better by serving elected office some nights......the attempts to pull them into some sort of mass conspiracy to deprive the people of their rights is silly. Most police officers I would venture to say, do not study the Constitution on a daily basis, they have many other laws passed by the Texas State Government to know and enforce......there is no liberal agenda by police, most that I know are conservative. I said very early in this debate that is the officer is acting on his own and against the law, fire him......but my guess is that he is supported by some union, so good luck with that.......

I love people who post stupid anti-police articles about nonsense because they have no knowledge of the field they are talking about, and then don't have enough class to admit when they are wrong. All is does is show they are uneducated in the topic and should keep quiet in the future.

I love when people don't even bother to read posts that they comment on. Anyone that knows me, or bothers to read my posts, knows I am ooozing with class! Which is why I know you don't bother to read my posts.

Perhaps you'd like to clarify what field of knowledge you speak of, or topic to which I am uneducated?

You could try to enter into intelligent discussion and identify which statements/positions you disagree with, post facts to support your statement/position and/or disprove my statements/positions, and we could have a reasonable discussion on the matter! I am reasonable... If I find myself to be wrong, I'll admit it. If I make a mistake, I apologize! Everytime. Go look through my posts.

Or you can just do the old tell me I'm a dumbass and you're an expert, and go to bed feeling like the superior being that you are. I'm cool with either!