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cinnamon creek ranch #4987740 02/23/14 03:16 AM
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rackbow Offline OP
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Lost my business for good today. I'll stick with Smithfield for work on my bow. Then go shoot out at Cowtown from now on.

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #4987750 02/23/14 03:19 AM
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Little more detail than that is needed. Why did they loose your business?

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Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #4987854 02/23/14 04:13 AM
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Wanted my bow paper tuned. Said it would cost $65 and they keep it overnight. Didn't think someone else could paper tune your bow. Also bought some arrows at Cabelas today and had them cut at CCR. I noticed the fletchings were bent from being in a box. Asked if they had a heat gun or hair dryer to straight them so I could shoot them while I was there. They asked if I bought them there and I said no I got them at Cabelas. The guy said they couldn't help me with that . Told me I could fix them at home with a hair dryer and just walked away. Then they even tried to charge me for the arrows when I went to pay for having them cut.

Drove the 30 minutes to Smithfield and they had no problem straightening the fletchings for me.

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #4987966 02/23/14 05:16 AM
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Chuck McDonald Offline
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Yes someone else can paper tune your bow, tuning has nothing to do with your shooting style and has everything to do with your nock, rest and arrow.

Frankly, going in somewhere and expecting people to provide free labor on something you bought somewhere else is a very high expectation unless you are a very good customer. I would have been embarrassed to even ask them to cut them for me.

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #4988038 02/23/14 06:39 AM
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rackbow Offline OP
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Smithfield had no problem fixing my problem. Not one time did I say I expected it for free. I would of been happy to pay for it but wasn't even given that opportunity.

I disagree with you on someone rise can paper tune your bow correctly. They can get close but not exact. Isn't exact what your are wanting when you paper tune? Their grip or release can vary from what you shoot.


What's wrong with taking arrows to them to cut? I bought the arrows with a gift card I had from Christmas. So basically you're saying you would be embarrassed to take a mower you bought from Sears to a mower shop to have the blade sharpened?

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #4988153 02/23/14 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted By: rackbow


I disagree with you on someone rise can paper tune your bow correctly. They can get close but not exact. Isn't exact what your are wanting when you paper tune? Their grip or release can vary from what you shoot.


The only way to correctly paper tune is to have a shooting machine and take human error out of the equation. Do you have one, I don't, but most shops do.

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #4988251 02/23/14 03:09 PM
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C abelas can cut arrows.


Live to hunt, forced to work!
Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: Chuck McDonald] #4988326 02/23/14 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted By: Chuck McDonald
Originally Posted By: rackbow


I disagree with you on someone rise can paper tune your bow correctly. They can get close but not exact. Isn't exact what your are wanting when you paper tune? Their grip or release can vary from what you shoot.


The only way to correctly paper tune is to have a shooting machine and take human error out of the equation. Do you have one, I don't, but most shops do.


This is bs because I paper tune my bow in my back yard. Your bow needs to be tuned to your shooting. Paper tuning is not only a great tool for your bow but a great tool to help you identify issues with your form.

I agree that it might rub a tech at a shop the wrong way if you bring in stuff bought elsewhere and want them to work on it but that's what they get paid to do. I've had cams changed, arrows cut to length, new strings installed and new equipment installed on bows at shops the bows weren't bought at. And that includes Cinnamon Creek. Yes those things are paid for, and I expect to pay for any service I receive. Doesn't matter if it's a bow or car or appliance. Cinnamon Creek has not given me any reason not to use them but Smithfield has not either. And I always get treated like an individual customer at Smithfield. Sometimes Cinnamon Creek is too busy to do that. So I try to pick my times. They have a very nice shop with lot's of toys to choose from. If you had a tech treat you that way talk to the owner. I'm sure he won't think it's okay.


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Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #4988436 02/23/14 05:57 PM
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So do I passthru, and walk back tune. Then I have had bows machine tuned and hmm my groups shrank. You don't have to believe it, but once you start seeing your arrows same hole multiple times on a machine, pick it up and you groups shrink in half, well...

There are a lot of things machine tuning will tell you, that you will never get out of hand tuning and vice versa. The OPs statement, was no one can tune your bow but you and that flat is not true. Maybe I went over the top on my previous statement, but machine tuning is a great starting point. Perhaps the only tuning you will need as long as you don't change anything.

The again maybe I am spoiled because all of my bows were initially tuned by Jerry Reeves formerly of RBO. He has tuned bows for factory guys who make a good portion of their living doing it, but heck what do those guys know either.

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #4988592 02/23/14 08:22 PM
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Well I have to agree that a machine is more consistent than a human can ever be but the same could be said about rifle shooting. A rifle shot out of a bench vise will shoot infinitely better than I can yet I don't hunt that way. My bow and rifle are held in my hands and my flaws are built into the equation. I also agree that having your bow tuned and set up at a shop that knows what they are doing is more likely to get you to trues center shot as well as close to where you will need to be to get tuned. But I've left shops where my bow was miserably off center shot after having new strings and cables set including the OPs chosen replacement shop so in the end it's the shooters responsibility to shoot, tune and know his bow as well as the limitations of both. I just know that I bought my current bow used, took it to Cinnamon Creek for set up, mostly because Stan was on vacation at the time, and they treated me as well as I needed and did a good job setting me up. Including shooting on their paper tune corner.


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Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #4988890 02/24/14 12:33 AM
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Back to the original subject, I have shot at CC but never really dealt with them as far as bow or arrow work is concerned. They seemed like a good bunch of folks. I will be shooting there in April at the Rinehart. Fun event for sure.

Last edited by Chuck McDonald; 02/24/14 12:33 AM.
Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #4999998 03/02/14 12:49 AM
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They have helped me out each time in the past. Took one of my bows out there today for them to install a QAD rest, Spot Hogg sight, new strings and paper tune. As in the past, they were very nice to deal with.

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5000048 03/02/14 01:28 AM
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CCR has been super to work with. They can get pretty busy though. I think it is probably all in who you deal with. Sometimes people have a bad day. Maybe the the guy was new. Personally, I am usually sensitive to asking someone to finish out something I bought elsewhere without checking with them first. But then I am not a long time bow hunter, so I am not sure what the norm is.

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: passthru] #5000200 03/02/14 03:44 AM
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[/quote] If you had a tech treat you that way talk to the owner. I'm sure he won't think it's okay. [/quote]
remember the prick who owned Arlington Bow Hunting World... same prick owns CCR!

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5000385 03/02/14 01:00 PM
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No, that guy doesn't/didn't own CCR, in fact I heard he doesn't work there any longer.

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: ttechcolleyville] #5000441 03/02/14 01:54 PM
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Originally Posted By: ttechcolleyville
CCR has been super to work with. They can get pretty busy though. I think it is probably all in who you deal with. Sometimes people have a bad day. Maybe the the guy was new. Personally, I am usually sensitive to asking someone to finish out something I bought elsewhere without checking with them first. But then I am not a long time bow hunter, so I am not sure what the norm is.


Same impression I had. Signed my son and I up for an intro class. The instructors were excellent and had the entire class warmed up, relaxed and safely shooting in no time. With helpful observations and suggestions slong the way, everyone's form and repeatability quickly improved. Good experience, will hsve to take my daughter next time, she would love it.

Afterwards we walked around the counters and tried to get our hands on a full size (non-trainer) style bow. The instructors had mentioned various makes/models that woukd work as either 'good to grow with' or a full range adjustment easy to shoot 'starter' bow. Unfortunately there was no one behind the counter to help us out. Place was jumpin and apparently max'd out for customer service so we floated on out to the parking lot.

That was when I realized that we had not signed in, out or paid for our class. laugh I told my son we had to go back inside to take care of business. Waited in line at the register and paid our tab and inquired about the bows mentioned before. Neither model was in stock because they had been replaced by 2014 models. Not a big deal, just didn't have time at that point to pursue it any further. I decided it might be better to float in during a weekday and avoid the swarm.


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Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5001442 03/03/14 12:44 AM
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His name is Ken Whit. He is a great bow tech. Customer service can be a little dry at times.


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Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5008464 03/06/14 07:49 PM
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They built strings for my bow before season. Draw length was too long. Didn't notice til I got home. I called them and told them about it and they told me that they put it back to factory spec. I knew this wasn't true because I have the factory spec sheet and the draw stops were not close. I put the draw stops to the factory settings and there was very very little valley. I took it back in and suggested that they built the strings too long and was told that isn't possible. I dealt with it for the rest of the year as I didn't have time to send it to RBO.

Not a fan of the strings they put on anyway. When I took it back in they had to reserve the nocking point because it was separating after about 10 shots. The serving is wore down and flattened where it contacts both draw mods.

I've since bought a press and have the parts to build a draw board so I can work on my own stuff.

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5009736 03/07/14 04:10 PM
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The mechanics of tuning a bow can be done by someone else. Timing, sync, lean, adjust ATA, draw stops (if applicable), rest adjustment, etc.

The part where an individual has to be involved in the process has to do with proper draw length adjustment, peep, and sight adjustment. I see a bunch of people shooting too long of a draw length pretty often. I also see some interesting form when on the line (often to compensate for improper draw length). All of that can be taken care of by working with a good coach.



As for CCR and their customer service, I agree that they could do better, especially when things get busy. I think part of the problem, is that they have too many kids up there that don't know what they are doing, so they do nothing. These kids seem to be the ones that want to argue when they don't know what else to do. I don't have much patience for that crap, and will not hesitate to talk to the manager about it. They have a handful of folks who are really amazing at getting things taken care of, and a couple of really good techs.

Ken seems to have more or less retired, I haven't seen much of him around up there in months. I dealt with him even before Arlington Bowhunting, when he was at Trophy Archery, and while he could sometimes seem a bit surly, I always got along with him pretty well. Personalities aside, there is no argument that he is a tremendous bow tech.


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Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5010027 03/07/14 07:01 PM
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I use to shoot at ken's place by lake Arlington. Life's to short to deal with
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Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5010653 03/08/14 01:11 AM
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I remember the days of Trophy archery. Still shoot the release I bought there.


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Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5027408 03/19/14 12:42 AM
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Was up there for three hours today shooting five different bows. Willie and David were setting up bows and a kid named Cole??? was chatting as I shot. Good customer experience. Now I have a decision to make.


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Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5031223 03/21/14 01:17 AM
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Well they have lost me and any referral I might of given them.


To each their own

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5032200 03/21/14 04:33 PM
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-1 here too. They tried to screw me over big time. I'll avoid them like the plague.

Re: cinnamon creek ranch [Re: rackbow] #5043997 03/29/14 01:17 AM
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ken was a little rude when I first met him but after being in there all the time I can say he knows his stuff. As far as ccr he left there. He was in a wreck. I sure do wish ken would open back up he was the best and taught me to shoot pretty dang good

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