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Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: Insight Hunting] #2387539 06/24/11 03:37 AM
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Originally Posted By: Insight Hunting
How much was that and in what era? I'm asking an honest question. I'd really like to know what should be considered fair.


$1-2 an acre is about right



"Hey running' buddy what'll say to a twelve pack"



Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: Insight Hunting] #2387544 06/24/11 03:39 AM
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Originally Posted By: Insight Hunting
How much was that and in what era? I'm asking an honest question. I'd really like to know what should be considered fair.


$200-400 leases in our area have jumped to $1500-2000ish since 07... It's priced a lot of folks out bc there's not much money in the area since the forest product market has been iffy.


Last edited by rifleman; 06/24/11 03:41 AM.
Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: matt117] #2387546 06/24/11 03:39 AM
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Originally Posted By: matt117
Originally Posted By: quartierleblanc
Cost is a huge problem and for practical purposes IS the problem. The little guy is priced out and a reason is high fence. It's not the only reason but it is a reason. The HFer's are essentially out for the trophy and are trying their best to produce that animal and at the same make a profit. Nothing wrong with that HOWEVER what is the downside or at least what is the downside of the way it's done now. Hunters are now looking at what is called price point and at what point are they looking for a substitute or at what point do they go overseas. At some point in time if the trend decreases then the state will recognize it as a revenue problem and apply governmental forces or the sport will end for lack of support and an endless supply of enemies who will win a war of attrition.



Face it, hunting in Texas is now for sport and not for food. And just like any sport people will use technology to pervert it. Bonds, Canseco and McGuire used steroids to excel in baseball and HF ranches use protein and selective breading to grow monster deer and use the fence to keep them from losing their investment. Here in Texas people who are poor cannot afford to hunt and in the past they were the ones who had to hunt in order to feed their families. Now instead of hunting to get food they go to McDonalds for the dollar menu. And the reality is that people with more money than sense will pay a ranch an insane amount of money to walk to a stand in flip flops stare at a protein feeder and then shoot a huge buck or exotic that is going to the easiest food source with very low hunting pressure. And talk about how that was the hunt of a lifetime.

So quit posting here and get over it, your arguement is weak and people think your a joke. Sorry...

The joke is on you. You still have a bill out there designed to stop HF hunting. It's no skin off my back but sure is on yours. Personally I don't care what you think. Hunters keep going away and the day of reckoning is approaching. The present system can't continue yet you think it can. Amazing.



Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: quartierleblanc] #2387563 06/24/11 03:52 AM
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Originally Posted By: quartierleblanc
Originally Posted By: matt117
Originally Posted By: quartierleblanc
Cost is a huge problem and for practical purposes IS the problem. The little guy is priced out and a reason is high fence. It's not the only reason but it is a reason. The HFer's are essentially out for the trophy and are trying their best to produce that animal and at the same make a profit. Nothing wrong with that HOWEVER what is the downside or at least what is the downside of the way it's done now. Hunters are now looking at what is called price point and at what point are they looking for a substitute or at what point do they go overseas. At some point in time if the trend decreases then the state will recognize it as a revenue problem and apply governmental forces or the sport will end for lack of support and an endless supply of enemies who will win a war of attrition.



Face it, hunting in Texas is now for sport and not for food. And just like any sport people will use technology to pervert it. Bonds, Canseco and McGuire used steroids to excel in baseball and HF ranches use protein and selective breading to grow monster deer and use the fence to keep them from losing their investment. Here in Texas people who are poor cannot afford to hunt and in the past they were the ones who had to hunt in order to feed their families. Now instead of hunting to get food they go to McDonalds for the dollar menu. And the reality is that people with more money than sense will pay a ranch an insane amount of money to walk to a stand in flip flops stare at a protein feeder and then shoot a huge buck or exotic that is going to the easiest food source with very low hunting pressure. And talk about how that was the hunt of a lifetime.

So quit posting here and get over it, your arguement is weak and people think your a joke. Sorry...

The joke is on you. You still have a bill out there designed to stop HF hunting. It's no skin off my back but sure is on yours. Personally I don't care what you think. Hunters keep going away and the day of reckoning is approaching. The present system can't continue yet you think it can. Amazing.


Dude you are a few cards short of a deck huh? I don't have a high fence ranch and if you actually read what I posted I don't care for HF "shooting" So what do I care. I hunt an 800 acre tract in Cherokee county Texas where it's so thick you can't shoot over 75 yards most the time. Heck the deer have so much food naturally you can't get them to a feeder. And if I ever see a buck over 130" and take it that will be an amazing feat.

I think you need to lay down the crack pipe sober up and find a new place to spew your misinformation.


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: matt117] #2387571 06/24/11 03:54 AM
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Wow is that best you have? I bet you'd like to kick my arse too.


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: quartierleblanc] #2387580 06/24/11 04:00 AM
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Originally Posted By: quartierleblanc
Wow is that best you have? I bet you'd like to kick my arse too.


No I am not an Internet tough guy but I have seen your dumbarse posting misinformation for the last few days and you must just be missing something that most normal people have. Your message has been the sky is falling they are going to ban high fence hunting. And the reality is that the proposed legislation (that you can never post correctly) is trying to ban HF hunting for EXOTICS on ranches under 1000 acres. It has nothing to do with whitetail. So wake up crack head. No one on here believes your misinformation.


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: matt117] #2387592 06/24/11 04:07 AM
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Hey Matt, I posted the original article. Remember that? Word for word. As for the internet tough guy, you've got a mouth on you but I kinda doubt it goes far from your computer. I know you'd never say it to my face. Here's another fact. The government can regulate through the USDA which could potentially affect hunting within HF property. They also intend to stop or severely restrict interstate transportation of exotic animals. If the anti's win this one, what next? Do you think they'll stop? Nah.


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: quartierleblanc] #2387597 06/24/11 04:11 AM
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I am sorry I offended your manhood and you must be a tough guy since you don't think I would say that to your face. You post an independent new article (we all know the new gets it right 100% of the time). I hope they do stop the importation of exotics because it could be dangerous to the natural ecosystem. There is a very good argument to the negative effects of introducing non native species. You Orwellian rhetoric doesn’t help anything. Guess what the sky’s not falling Chicken Little.


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: matt117] #2387606 06/24/11 04:16 AM
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rofl Chicken little



"Hey running' buddy what'll say to a twelve pack"



Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: Lazy L] #2387613 06/24/11 04:25 AM
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Total powderpuff old son. You're laughable if you weren't so disappointing in the backbone department. I've never insulted anyone here. Yet you find your guts in a keyboard. Typical. But back to the politics. The same thing was said about the assault weapon bill during the Clinton administration and the final bill was far worse than what was initially proposed. It would be very foolish to think this bill is not dangerous.


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: Lazy L] #2387630 06/24/11 04:40 AM
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I've stayed out of this for the most part as I don't see how any good or productivity will come out of anything I have to offer via a keyboard.

That said, there is ALOT of misinformation, mis-understanding & mis-statement of fact & personal butt-hurt being thrown around.

quartierleblanc/JWP58/Nogalus Prairie, if you folks have not had the oppty to actually step foot on an HF ranch (or even if you have), I'd like to extend an invitation to each of you to come & tour our ranch for a morning/day/afternoon. My only caveaut, is that you remain respectful of me, my family & our property. No strings attached, just come see the place & I'll try to make it a fun day of riding ranch roads, chit-chatting, etc & try to provide an objective view from a landowner/steward/fellow hunter perspective. Hopefully this would be mutually benefical to all of us.

Please PM me if this would be of interest to any of you.


Last edited by RodinaRanč; 06/24/11 04:48 AM.

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Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: quartierleblanc] #2387659 06/24/11 06:00 AM
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quartierleblanc:

If you really want to help hunting, then step away from the keyboard, stop spewing your mis-information, and take a kid hunting.

We all know that the number of hunters is decreasing. Duh! It has to do with the demographics of the country, nore urban, less rural, etc. HF's are not even on the radar screen.

The fact is that the number of fishermen is declining faster than the number of hunters, do you think HF's are causing the decrease in fisherment, too?

You have made a complete fool of yourself on this forum. Do yourself a favor and go away!


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: JJH] #2387699 06/24/11 08:53 AM
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Originally Posted By: JJH
quartierleblanc:

If you really want to help hunting, then step away from the keyboard, stop spewing your mis-information, and take a kid hunting.

We all know that the number of hunters is decreasing. Duh! It has to do with the demographics of the country, nore urban, less rural, etc. HF's are not even on the radar screen.

The fact is that the number of fishermen is declining faster than the number of hunters, do you think HF's are causing the decrease in fisherment, too?

You have made a complete fool of yourself on this forum. Do yourself a favor and go away!


Yep, I agree! Constant false information blabber and back pedaling. First it's the states deer and then someone set you straight the deer belong to the people. You keep trying to scare somebody and no one is taking the bait. You bash the way we hunt in Texas, yet you don't even deer hunt, so why do you really care? I'm wondering if you are part of this bill you keep bringing up, so you can make yourself feel special. You aleady have been proven to have set up another account with a new name, why is that? Were you banned the first time or did people just get tired of your non sense?


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: grout-scout] #2387747 06/24/11 11:56 AM
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I am more shocked about the decline in fishing than hunting. Fishing is still cheap and more accessible than hunting will ever be. Rodinaranc that is a very nice offer you made to them hopefully they will take you up on that offer.



"Hey running' buddy what'll say to a twelve pack"



Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: grout-scout] #2387771 06/24/11 12:17 PM
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Hey grout, when the law says the deer belong to the people it means the people as in plural and IS the state not an individual. You don't even know the difference. Now I'm setting you straight. Hope you get it.


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: rifleman] #2387782 06/24/11 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted By: Insight Hunting
How much was that and in what era? I'm asking an honest question. I'd really like to know what should be considered fair.


Originally Posted By: Keith Stone
$1-2 an acre is about right



Originally Posted By: rifleman
$200-400 leases in our area have jumped to $1500-2000ish since 07... It's priced a lot of folks out bc there's not much money in the area since the forest product market has been iffy.


I agree with ya'll that costs are rising and I wish it was cheaper. That's a universal problem. But with corn at $7 to $10 a sack and gas at $3.50 a gallon I'm not sure I'd want to allowing hunting on my property (if I owned any land, that is) for an amount that wouldn't even cover my taxes.

I'm not well versed in lease prices because it's mostly day-hunting around here. It looks like the going rate is about $7 to $10 an acre. That large of a jump since 2007 is very large.

I know it's hard because land ownership and hunting are both a tradition and a business. It takes money for these ranches to operate. I come from a land-rich / cash poor family and have seen everyone working like dogs just to keep food on the table and the land out of the hands of the Government because of taxes. That being said, I believe there are still some cost-effective hunts out there. Will you find a place with year-round access, camping and hunting for $2 and acres? Doubtful, but you can't stay in a State Park for that.

We're complaining about the $5000 trophy hunt but that's not the norm. There are still many, many economical hunts out there.



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Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: Insight Hunting] #2387799 06/24/11 12:34 PM
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I brought up to you the idea of using the concession method with several ranch properties merging into one. Property owners who participate would get a tax break and their money up front. You'd have one management team so it would be cost effective. In order to get more hunters you woudn't even have to sell a whole season, just chunks of it. The majority of the trophy fees for full fledged trophies could be shared by the landowners as well. It would also mean more people coming into a given area which would benefit the local economy.


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: quartierleblanc] #2387815 06/24/11 12:45 PM
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Holy cow, are you actually suggesting that land owners effectively give their land away to a “group” so that hunting can be affordable to “everyone”? Comrade, that may be how socialism works but that aint how we roll in Texas.

The last few pages make you sound like you are bitter about not being able to afford to hunt HF. Jealously does not look good on you.


Originally Posted By: quartierleblanc
I brought up to you the idea of using the concession method with several ranch properties merging into one. Property owners who participate would get a tax break and their money up front. You'd have one management team so it would be cost effective. In order to get more hunters you woudn't even have to sell a whole season, just chunks of it. The majority of the trophy fees for full fledged trophies could be shared by the landowners as well. It would also mean more people coming into a given area which would benefit the local economy.




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Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: godfather] #2387824 06/24/11 12:50 PM
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They're not giving anything away. The are effectively leasing it to a professional management group for hunting rights only with guaranteed income up front and the likelehood of more profit downstream. They also get a tax break as well as getting out of the cost of hunter support. More money, less expense and the professional management sounds like a good deal. They still own and control the land.


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: godfather] #2387829 06/24/11 12:53 PM
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I'm aware other states provide less rights to land-owners. Yes, the deer are public property but they're living on private land. To force land-owners to open their property for hunting will create a situation similar to what we have now with navigable waterways. The water belongs to the "people" and they have limited, State-mandated use of the shoreline. So this land-owner spends lots of time and money to improve his property only to have some stranger float in and use it. There's nothing like spending 2 hours a week picking up someones beer cans and crappy diapers to make you ready to throw open your gates for the common good.



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Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: quartierleblanc] #2387831 06/24/11 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted By: quartierleblanc
They're not giving anything away. The are effectively leasing it to a professional management group for hunting rights only with guaranteed income up front and the likelehood of more profit downstream. They also get a tax break as well as getting out of the cost of hunter support. More money, less expense and the professional management sounds like a good deal. They still own and control the land.


There's nothing preventing that from happening now. If a group of landowners want to do that more power to 'em. You have brokers who do hunting deals like that now as well as lease managers who organize hunters for community leases. They're dispised as "middle-men" and profiteers.



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Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: quartierleblanc] #2387855 06/24/11 01:09 PM
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To what end? Why whould a land owner do this?

Originally Posted By: quartierleblanc
They're not giving anything away. The are effectively leasing it to a professional management group for hunting rights only with guaranteed income up front and the likelehood of more profit downstream. They also get a tax break as well as getting out of the cost of hunter support. More money, less expense and the professional management sounds like a good deal. They still own and control the land.




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Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: Insight Hunting] #2387857 06/24/11 01:10 PM
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There is something like this in Schleicher County... But they high fenced it.


Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: Insight Hunting] #2387934 06/24/11 01:46 PM
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I agree with ya'll that costs are rising and I wish it was cheaper. That's a universal problem. But with corn at $7 to $10 a sack and gas at $3.50 a gallon I'm not sure I'd want to allowing hunting on my property (if I owned any land, that is) for an amount that wouldn't even cover my taxes.


Heck I paid 11.10 per 50lbs last week, but this and gas I have no control over so I have to just complain. Not all hunters get a lease to just hunt deer. The lease I was on last year, the deer hunting was horrible. But I no problem paying the money because I was in good company with the other hunters, lots of pigs to trap or shoot, and the fishing was awesome. Well this year no one will be getting on because the landowners wife found out that people will actually pay good money to pig hunt for the day. Well we all have heard the horror stories of how that would play out. It's sad because we were paying $1200 for 1400 acres. This type of thing is happening every year and $ is king. Half the guys I hunted with are not even looking for a lease this year that money is headed to Colorado for an elk hunt. Luckily I have my fathers place to still hunt on, but I will not be looking for another lease anytime in the near future.



"Hey running' buddy what'll say to a twelve pack"



Re: How to help the hunting industry..... [Re: Lazy L] #2387963 06/24/11 01:59 PM
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Originally Posted By: Keith Stone
your post


I keep a lease in Red River co cuz the guys on it are great to hang with, the price is right (like under 500) and I can store all my feeders, stands and stuff. The hunting is not great but we do get some very nice deer on cam every year, in fact we have a contest every year to see who can get the best buck (on cam).



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