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#1812700 - 11/07/10 10:02 PM winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt
coonsaw Offline
Bird Dog

Registered: 02/06/10
Posts: 471
Loc: dfw
i have narrowed down my search for bolt action to the browning x-bolt synthetic with dura touch or a winchester model 70 in wood or the extreme weather and textured stock. both feel great, actions are nice, i dont really like synthetic stocks because of the plastic feel but both of these feel great. love the dura touch. i know it boils down to personal preference but what are some advantages/disadvantages of both. always shot a marlin 30/30 and never owned high power bolt action so dont really know much about the safety on either one, not a huge fan of stainless, would prefer all black if synthetic but assume it has some noticable advantages. let me know your thoughts please. been back and forth for about a year now trying every gun out there and these two have made it to the finals.

also, does anybody have or shot the m70 stealth? it is winchester heavy barrel version. looks bad to the bone on their website.

coonsaw



Edited by coonsaw (11/07/10 10:07 PM)

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#1812927 - 11/07/10 11:56 PM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: coonsaw]
TexasTransplant Offline
Pro Tracker

Registered: 01/23/08
Posts: 1450
Loc: OK
The model 70 recoil lug is an integral part of the receiver. It's a very thick, machined surface. The x-bolt, like the a-bolt, Savage, and Remington, use a recoil lug that is screwed on between the receiver and barrel. The screwed-on recoil lugs from the factory are stamped and typically cannot be trusted to be flat or true. That's less of an issue if it's bedded, but still not as good as if replaced with an aftermarket heavy duty lug (and then bedded).

The X-bolt gets 8 screws to hold the bases down. I'm not convinved that's a real-world advantage over the traditional 4 bolt design.

The X-bolt has a 2 position safety and a button on the bolt handle that allows you to work the action while the bolt is still safe. It looks like un-necessary complication and inconvenience compared to the traditional Winchester 3-position safety. Even so, I would be surprised if it didn't work or wasn't reliable.

They are similar in many other ways.

Both are fantastic rifles with brand names that have consistently maintained a high quality standard.

_________________________


She was only a whiskey maker, but he loved her still.

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#1813142 - 11/08/10 07:56 AM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: TexasTransplant]
Bit Man Offline
Woodsman

Registered: 11/25/09
Posts: 212
Loc: Midland, TX
If your not gonna go with a model 700 remmy, then a model 70 win it must be! 3rd would be a ruger m77. Then a savage for me before I would want a browning rifle, just my opinion though!

_________________________
Watch your top knot.

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#1813897 - 11/08/10 11:15 AM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: Bit Man]
LandPirate Offline
THF Celebrity

Registered: 08/18/09
Posts: 10026
Loc: Buda/Kyle
I once traded a fine shooting Browning A-bolt for a Winchester Model 70 Super Grade w/ Pre-64 action. Damn thing wouldn't hold a group. Tried different ammo, bedded and floated, trigger job nothing would work. Best it ever shot was 1.5" group at 100 yards. I promptly traded it for another Browning A-bolt. That Browning shot .5" groups at 100 yards straight out of the box and factory ammo. I still have that rifle and use the heck out of it.

_________________________
Mike
Buda/Kyle, TX

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#1813906 - 11/08/10 11:18 AM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: Bit Man]
Canazes9 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 10/21/06
Posts: 669
Loc: Lumberton, Tx
Those are 2 fairly dissimilar, but excellent bolt action rifles. The Winchester model 70 is a controlled round feed rifle. The X-bolt is a push feed rifle. Controlled round feed is just that, from the moment the cartridge is stripped out of the magazine, the bolt grabs and holds it until it is pushed off the bolt face by the extractor. Push feed actions don't grab the cartridge until just before the bolt is locked. Controlled feed is often talked up for dangerous game, however, folks have been known to short stroke the bolt trying to get off a second shot for deer. Short stroke the bolt w/ controlled round and retry you will only eject an unfired cartridge, picking up the next one to shoot. Most likely you will jam a push feed action in the same scenario.

The Winchester has a claw extractor (part of the controlled round feed), the Browning x-bolt uses a Sako style extractor. Reams have been written about which system has more extraction force but the fact is other than the aformentioned controlled round function there is no practical performance edge to either.

The model 70 has a 90 degree bolt throw, the Browning x-bolt uses a 60 degree bolt throw. Not a huge difference, but for sure the 60 degree bolt throw is faster and less likely to have clearance problems between the bolt handle and scope.

Controlled round feed actions tend to be rougher than push feed actions. The model 70 is one of the best controlled round feed mauser 98 style actions that you can buy, the Browning x-bolt is one of the best push feed actions you can buy. Now way around it, the browning feels smoother.

The model 70 uses a fixed ejector, the x-bolt uses a plunger style ejector. Both work fine, however, w/ the model 70's fixed style ejector how hard you eject is up to you: rack the bolt quickly trying to get another round off and it flings brass w/ authority, gently pull back the bolt and it will gently deposit unfired rounds or fired brass in your hand. The x-bolt ejector will fling w/ equal gusto regardless of how fast the bolt is operated - when the round/brass clears the port it's gone if you don't catch it!

The model 70 uses a simple, effective 3 position safety - the x-bolt accomplishes the same thing but their safety is not as easy to use or differentiate at a glance what condition it's in.

The model 70 has a large 180 degree loading port to load and remove cartridges, the Browning port is smaller.

The model 70 uses a hinged floor flat spring style magazine, the Browning uses a rotary detachable magazine. The model 70 magazine functions fine, the browning rotary style is among the smoothest most reliable feed types. The model 70 can be unloaded very easily by dropping the hinged floor plate dumping all cartridges in your hand. The x-bolt can quicly drop the magazine from the rifle, but removing the cartridges from the magazine for storage will require either cycling them with bolt or manually stripping them w/ your fingers. Finally the model 70 magazine will always be with the rifle, the Browning detachable magazine has the possibility of being lost or misplaced (left at home?).

There is no discernable difference in accuracy between the two. Both are capable of better accuracy than is needed for a hunting rifle, both are capable of being made even more accurate in the hands of a skilled gunsmith.

Both rifles are reliable, should serve well in the field for generations to come.

My choice would be the more traditional model 70, but the more modern x-bolt is also a great choice.

HTH

David


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#1814016 - 11/08/10 11:51 AM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: coonsaw]
exoticbob Offline
Pro Tracker

Registered: 06/21/06
Posts: 1971
Loc: Baytown
buy 1 of each, but in different calibers. both great rifles. you can't go wrong either way.


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#1814477 - 11/08/10 02:00 PM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: Canazes9]
TexasTransplant Offline
Pro Tracker

Registered: 01/23/08
Posts: 1450
Loc: OK
Originally Posted By: Canazes9
Those are 2 fairly dissimilar, but excellent bolt action rifles. The Winchester model 70 is a controlled round feed rifle.

The pre-64 is a controlled feed, the later model 70s are also push feed. Both the X-bolt and current edition model 70s use basically the same feed and extraction engineering. But, as you pointed out, they use different ejection technology:

Originally Posted By: Canazes9
The model 70 uses a fixed ejector, the x-bolt uses a plunger style ejector. Both work fine, however, w/ the model 70's fixed style ejector how hard you eject is up to you: rack the bolt quickly trying to get another round off and it flings brass w/ authority, gently pull back the bolt and it will gently deposit unfired rounds or fired brass in your hand. The x-bolt ejector will fling w/ equal gusto regardless of how fast the bolt is operated - when the round/brass clears the port it's gone if you don't catch it!

I agree with Canazes' other fine points on bolt throw, loading port, floor plate versus detachable magazine, accuracy, improvability, quality, and final choice.

_________________________


She was only a whiskey maker, but he loved her still.

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#1814561 - 11/08/10 02:23 PM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: TexasTransplant]
Canazes9 Offline
Tracker

Registered: 10/21/06
Posts: 669
Loc: Lumberton, Tx
Actually the New Winchesters are all controlled round feed same as the pre64 models. The push feed models are history....

http://www.winchesterguns.com/products/catalog/category.asp?family=001C

Today's Model 70 has the all new M.O.A.™ Trigger System, improved fit and finish and enhanced accuracy to go along with its classic Pre-’64 controlled round feeding, Three-Position Safety and solid, sure handling. The M.O.A. Trigger helps the model 70 deliver the extreme accuracy benchmark 1" group at 100 yards. It’s what you deserve in your rifle.

David


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#1814650 - 11/08/10 02:47 PM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: Canazes9]
CitySlickerHunter Offline
Veteran Tracker

Registered: 04/01/06
Posts: 3026
Loc: Tarrant County,TX
I sure like My M70 (.300wsm) Don't know if it is better then a X-bolt(NEVER shot one), but I'd buy another Winchester flag

_________________________
"I can't be over gunned because the animal can't be over dead"-Elmer Keith
10/30/2012 I VOTED for The American

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#1814673 - 11/08/10 02:54 PM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: CitySlickerHunter]
Bassinfool Offline
Outdoorsman

Registered: 07/27/05
Posts: 98
Loc: Cleburne, Texas
I love my Winchester Mod 70 in the .270 cal and would keep it forever because it is very accurate, however, I am wanting to trade it for a Weatherby .257 Mag.


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#1815390 - 11/08/10 06:37 PM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: Bassinfool]
coonsaw Offline
Bird Dog

Registered: 02/06/10
Posts: 471
Loc: dfw
wow. thanks for all the info. it is still a tossup but i think the mod70 is gaining traction. i have always loved traditional wood rifles and never been a big fan of synthetic stocks. the m70 wood is beautiful and i think i should get it on tradition alone. however i have to admit i am seduced a little by the styling of the xbolt in wood and the duratouch coat on the synthetic feels like a million bucks to me. i had to reread some of the posts here that were talking about some technical aspects of both and will go over it a few more times until it soaks in.

anybody have the winchester stealth? curious about that one too. different animal but i am curious.

thanks again

coonsaw


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#1815666 - 11/08/10 07:47 PM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: Canazes9]
TexasTransplant Offline
Pro Tracker

Registered: 01/23/08
Posts: 1450
Loc: OK
Originally Posted By: Canazes9
Actually the New Winchesters are all controlled round feed same as the pre64 models. The push feed models are history....

http://www.winchesterguns.com/products/catalog/category.asp?family=001C

Today's Model 70 has the all new M.O.A.™ Trigger System, improved fit and finish and enhanced accuracy to go along with its classic Pre-’64 controlled round feeding, Three-Position Safety and solid, sure handling. The M.O.A. Trigger helps the model 70 deliver the extreme accuracy benchmark 1" group at 100 yards. It’s what you deserve in your rifle.

David


Well look how out of date I am. hammer

If the wikipedia article is correct, it looks like they went back to controlled feed around 1992 on some models, but other sources indicate it was a few years earlier than that. At the same time, they also introduced a controlled round push feed. So it looks like there are 2 types of push feed, and 2 generations of Winchesters with the external extractor. It's not exactly clear to me when they wholly adopted the old extractor system for all models - it looks like 2007. Anybody know?

PS: I have a standard grade M70 from the mid 70s that has performed flawlessly. I would get another Winchester.



Edited by TexasTransplant (11/08/10 07:49 PM)
_________________________


She was only a whiskey maker, but he loved her still.

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#1815701 - 11/08/10 07:56 PM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: TexasTransplant]
dee Offline
Extreme Tracker

Registered: 04/10/10
Posts: 3606
Loc: Red River way
I have a FN bolt .308 which is a Winchester M70 its crf and scary accurate, if I was gonna buy a new bolt action it would be a new M70.

_________________________
"A vote is like a rifle; it's usefulness depends on the character of the user" Theodore Roosevelt

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#1816141 - 11/08/10 09:21 PM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: dee]
Lone Ranger Offline
Pro Tracker

Registered: 09/17/04
Posts: 1270
Loc: Irving, Texas
My vote goes to the Model 70 all the way!! I have 10 of them in various calibers and configurations. I also have a pre-64 Featherweight. One of my favorite wood models is the Featherweight. I also have a couple of stainless models with the fiberglass stock. All of my Model 70's except for 1 are control round feed, which in my opinion is the best. I also prefer the 3 positon safety over all others.

My son-in-law just purchased a new Model 70 Extreme Weather SS in 270WSM a couple of months ago. He shot 2 big hogs with it this past weekend.

I am a Browning fan as well, especially for shotguns, but the Model 70 is my all time favorite rifle!! All of the ones I have ever had have been extremely accurate and very good looking too.


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#1816165 - 11/08/10 09:25 PM Re: winchester m70 vs browning x-bolt [Re: Lone Ranger]
deerhunter721 Offline
Woodsman

Registered: 12/14/09
Posts: 139
No question for me. I'd go with the Model 70. But shoot what is most comfortable for you.


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