Hey guys,

My family owns some land in the central Texas area and it's recently started to see a growth in Ashe Juniper (Cedar) in places where it's never been before.

My dad explained, and websites have confirmed that it's quite a nuisance and will slowly overtake the landscape if left unmanaged.

I'm in complete agreeance with him on that, but I need to better understand how to get rid of it. Websites indicate that I need a very special concoction of chemicals ect, and honestly I've always found that there are household chemicals/daily items you guys use to rid certain plant life. (I.e. diesel fuel used on mesquite trees)

Have any of you guys addressed this problem? If so, what methods seem to work best?

If they are new growth start spraying them NOW..young ones dont do well with dozers..I know it can be a pain to drive around,but in the long run you will be glad you did..Most feed stores see a spray now...One rancher I know adds a cup of Diesel to the 5 gallon sprayer with the mix in it to add a little punch..His place is incredible...

we've declared war on the cedars on our place in Coryell County. It's insane how much money you can spend to just make a dent in it.

We bought 2 Stihl brush cutters. Basically a big weedeater with carbide tipped blades. You just walk around and cut off the little ones. You have to cut them off at ground level to kill them.

Then we bought a dozer to push over the big ones. It works well, but you leave holes where you push them and could cause some erosion problems.

Last year we added a Bobcat with a tree shear. This thing works really well on all but the biggest ones. On the bigger ones, you just have to work your way around the trunk to cut them off.

The most important thing is to start cutting the ones under your oak trees. They will starve the oaks for water and kill them eventually.

Eason1025 and MELackey,

Thanks so much for your responses. I'm being told that the majority of these aren't mature so I suspect we will just need chain saws to cut them at their bases.

That being said, on one thats a little larger would it be possible to push them over with a truck? I've got a Ranch Hand front end replacement on my SuperDuty. I know it's not a dozer but it's got some weight behind it. Thoughts on that?

Secondly, Easton, what kind of herbicide does your rancher friend use?

you will be surprised how hard these things are to push over. I don't think you will have much success using your truck, unless you figure out some sort of a grubbing attachment for it. Even then, traction will be what you find hardest to overcome. We have a CaseIH 5140 4wd tractor (fairly good size and weight) with a front end loader. You can push some with it if the ground is soft enough, but traction is what it is lacking, even with 4 wheels turning and a heavy tractor.

When using a chainsaw, you will find that cedar dulls the cutting edges REALLY fast, so make sure you take your file into the field with you.

If you have many at all, I'd seriously consider a trimmer with a brush cutting blade. Your back will thank you, and you can really make quick work of a pasture.

well i will tell you from experience that its a pain in the [censored]...We own 1100 acres in barksdale texas and have a wwhole fleet of equipment just for clearing cedar and have been at it hard forabout 15 years now we have a JD 450 dozer a JD 350 dozer a case 580 loader and a new john deere skid loader with 14 inch shears...the dozers do good esp the 450 with the 6 way blade so u can use a little corner to grub up little ones but the tree shears are by far thee best thing we have invested in as of date they dont tear up the land at all they are quick and as stated above you dont get the big whole from the giant root systen they have. Now you must and absolutley must cut them off below the last green leaf or needle or they will just grow back so make surre you do this or you will be doing it again next year...another option is if you have big cedar you can get some cedar choppers to come out free of charge and chop it and haul it for free and you may even possibly be able to get a cut out of it as it sells for about 50 dollars a ton to a mill...and yet another option and one of the best esp if its still all small is to burn it in a prescribed burn and you can find people who will do this for free on your place this is the best option my cousins did this on about 5000 acres of their ranch north of vance texas and it made huge improvments and even had some springs start to run water again after years of being dry(it has been stated that 1 cedar tree takes up four times aws much water as four oak trees its size...hence all the dry river bed in the hill country)as you can tell i am a wealth of knowledge on the fight on cedar as i have been in this war since i was first turned loose on a dozer at about 11 yrs old if you need any info on your cedar let me know ill be glad to help....also you are sussposed to get a permit to cut cedar because of the golden cheeked warbler (stupid as audobon society) we had to get a govt man come ok our cedar so never ever let audobon or anyone posing as anykind of wildlifeor surveyor on your place as they can get your cedar cutting operation shut down for good then your in big trouble

oh and i promise you the truck thing wont work......hill country terrain=lots of rocks on top of rocks on top of solid rock=no traction

If you can find it "Garlon" will any tree deader than dead. But I think it's been off the market for 10 years+. Other than that cutting em of and treating the stump with 2-4D will work..it's part of the winter weed or broad leaf control chemicals you'll find. Not sure how well it will work if just applied to a living tree though. And of course there's always fire.

Get rid of them...they suck up the water at an ungodly rate. I heard as high as 500 gallons per day.

and you will end up buying a new set of tires for that truck...

cedars need to go but there is a right way and a wrong way to do it.....i've seen alot of properties in the hill country look like they got napalmed due to bad cedar removal.

Rayco makes a machine that eats up cedar, not pushing it over, then mulches it out.....cedar eaters of texas uses them.

its alot cleaner job

If you want to do it yourself with herbicide, get a jug of Remedy and mix it 3 oz to 1 gal of diesel. That mix will kill anything I've sprayed - mesquite, cat claw, briars, prickly pear, just make sure to get good foliar coverage.

I will try to get some more information on this stuff that kills them. A few pellets and it kills them when it rains. There are different size buckets of it and different prices. I would guess the big bucket would kill 1,000 cedars
I try to us on the smaller cedar and leave the larger ones to the bulldozer.

See if this is the site. http://www.pro-serveinc.com/mesquite.html

Like others, we declared war on cedars. The small ones we take out with loppers - the bigger ones we get with chainsaws. In addition, we hired a guy that came out with a skidsteer and the mulching attachment - works great but kind of expensive.

We started out by taking out the cedars around the oaks and pecans. We seem to cut on them every weekend down at the ranch. I am not sure if we are ever going to get them all but every little bit helps.

When the company with the skidsteer came out the last time he took out a thick portion all around a dry, spring fed creek. About a week later we had running water and there was no rain during the week - would not of believed it without seeing it first hand.

We go through alot of chains on the chainsaws. A brand new chain will last us about 2 days while one that has been sharpened by the local small engine shop only last about 4 hours.

Good luck

Letsgo...I have done the same think with the cedars at my place...Just some weekend work..I go around all the oaks and pecans that have cedar undergrowth and clear it out...Its AMAZING how much those trees have grown in a year!!!I stopped during deer season,but plan on resuming in a couple weeks...

I'm from Hays Co. and have also been at it since age 10 or so. Other than what's been said:

1)If you're trying to keep them out of a clearing, cut the big ones then take your shredder thru on high a few times a year. The shredder does a good job on the little trees before they get established.

2) Definitely start with the cedars that are crowding out your oaks. They will slowly kill the oaks, but you'd be amazed at how the oaks will come back after you thin them out.

Other than that carry some loppers and clip the small ones as you see them. Those things are relentless.

1st post here and I don't want to come across like I know more than I do but the pellets Oisin were referring to are called Pronone Power Pellets. They work fairly well. 1 pellet per inch of trunk placed around the bole of the cedar. I used them once on a hundred acre pasture and had a 75% kill. Went over it again three years later complete the job. Cover the pellets so stock won't eat them, though.

controled burn is the best way. It is the way the area used to manage its self before cattle ranchers changed the landscape. Nothing against ranchers I promise. Grazing is what changed the habitat out there and putting out fires as they pop up also destroyed the lanscape. get your property on a burning schedule and you wont have a problem. Counties extension service should have info on when and how often to do a controlled burn.

Once you get cedar you really never get rid of it. Getting rid of it depends how deep your pocket book is. My 15 acre place cost me thousands to shread it. It still pops up each year. Good luck

From the files of overly big government.

I know an individual who used to pour diesel fuel on railroad ties for the hogs to rub against. He mentioned it in a public forum or two and soon received a visit from some governement employee attached to some local environmental office. They threatened to pursue charges based on polluting the ground and hazardous materials blah blah blah.....

I would be careful about admitting to spraying diesel fuel or anything else like that around the landscape, especially close to creeks, streams, tanks, etc.....

And no, I didn't hear about this through an e-mail I got from my kid sister's, step-brother's uncle, twice removed.

Mike we are in Mills county and declared war on cedar a few years ago. Most of our cedar country was rough, rocky, creek bank, hilly, and not to mention very snake infested. After a lot of thinking and planning concerning labor, herbicides, and mechanical control we purchased a 1986 Komatsu D21P dozer with 6 way blade and sweeps with rops cab. This rig ways about 9500 lbs and has 40 hp engine. We added a grubber for mesquite control. Its runs on red diesel at 3/4 rpms for more than hour on 1 gal. This little dozer took on every cedar we had regardless of size. It maintains the cedar and mesquites sprouts yearly as well as many other issues around the ranch. These used rigs can be bought for under $10,000. and with out the extras for much less. Just a thought for you to consider.

We just cleared out a 5 mile long path of cedar for a hiking trail for the BRA around Possum Kingdom Lake.
We used Lone Star Land Enhancement, Inc. from Lindale.
Awesome guys. They used the "mulcher" attachments on the front of skid steers and small tractors. The $ was pretty reasonable.
Maybe worth using to at least get the cedars cleared out in a hurry.
You can then manage it yourself.
PM if you need any information on them.
Here is their website:
www.LoneStarLandEnhancement.com

On our lease in Burnet the landowner finally cleared his new growth cedars (1-8 or 10 footers). He hired 2 ceadr chaompers from south of the border for $50/acre. The bad thing about them was that they left the cedar right where it fell. I had to clear a lot off the roads. We were talking about cleaning them all up and maybe burning. TP&W actually recommends leaving them because grass seed srouts under them and the animals will not mess with it if there are easier pickings. You might want to leave some and let them mature. We have a fair amount of old growth and the deer love them when it gets cold. Also, there is a lot of greenery under the canopy in the winter. You can see under the old growth and the deer can walk right through.

I have been clearing juniper for years in the hill country. I started with an s-10 pick up and a long chain hooked to the tree as high as possible then take a run to the end of the chain. My little truck would sometime leave the ground. I went to dozers but we don't have much top soil so when we uprooted the trees and when it rained our loose soil went to the neighbor's property and our rocks flourished. My heavy equipment was expensive to operate, move around and expensive to maintain.

Finally, we moved to tree sheers and skid loaders. You can cut the "blue berry juniper" to the ground and it won't return, but the "red berry" will return. We tried the mulchers and found that roadways, fence lines and various right-of-ways it was great. Downside--It will take about 6-10 years to breakdown to point that grass will grow. I don't recommend it for areas you would like to replant with seed.
We came up with an attachment for the smaller regrowth (1/2"-5"dia.) and you can maintain it with a lawnmower after it's cleared (rocks not included). There is a web site you can see it operate. It is particularly effective around your hardwood trees. Feel free to contact me for any help I may be. www.brushshark.com

Mike

Remedy works very well for controlling cedar.

Kinda off topic, but the people who posted on here that said that water started flowing after they got rid of the cedar is just simply amazing. Probably the most interesting information I have ever heard. I think that if more information is put out about this and the "right" politicians know about this, Texas might fund landowners to help remove the cedars. Water is a huge commodity in the state and we need every bit we can get. Great information guys. Thanks.